Should we not start him tonight?

Johnson, Hinske, Gomes

I wouldn’t call that anytthing…

You’ve got to say, the Rays are not sitting on their hands. They make moves, and while any move can be criticized, every one can be justified. This looks like a very good move for us, to get a major leaguer with some upside for an A ball pitcher in a deep system.

Looks like a good move to me and as we have talked before it was for a guy that was completely off the radar. In fact MLB Trade Rumors had Gross going to the A’s.

Is there any lefty bench hitter the Rays won’t have before the end of the season?

At this rate Bonds is a shoo-in.

Haynes does not hurt you in the OF or on the base paths…got a decent bat and IS the fast player on the team, hands down…yup faster than Crawford…so I see Gomes getting shipped out soon, I dont think Maddon likes him…well atleast that the only excuse I have on why he doesnt play everyday….he is a horrible OFer though

what have the other options shown this year?

I would prefer to have Gomes, Ruggiano and Gross as RF alternatives to having Haynes out there. But it is far too early in the year to use statistics from 2008 to tell us much.

I would never say that Juan Pierre is a good ballplayer. But suppose Haynes is Juan Pierre but a good fielder who takes more walks? Would he be useful as a 4th or 5th outfielder?

If we are going to consider stats, we have to look beyond 2008. In his last two years in the minors, when he has received at least 150 ABs, here are Haynes’s stats:
2006: AA: 207 ABs; .280/.351/.406; 22 BBs; 49 Ks; 14 Doubles; 3 Triples

2007: AAA; 171 ABs; .386/.462/.579; 22 BBs; 36 Ks; 9 Doubles; 6 Triples

More interesting is that in 2007 he had 126 ABs vs. righties and hit .444/.510/651. Of course this is in a notorious hitters league and with a BABIP of .520! And those numbers reflect a small sample as well.

But his last two years in the high minors suggests he can hit for some average and take some walks. So the real question is not whether he is better than Ruggiano, which I doubt, but who suits the team’s needs better right now.

If Ruggiano stays, do we then get a platoon of Ruggiano/Gross with Gomes/Hinske platooning at DH? If so, Gomes’s & Hinske’s ABs are both reduced, and I am not sure we want that right now. Or Ruggiano simply sits most of the time which seems a waste of his development time. But if Haynes is the last outfielder, a rotation of 3 players (Gomes, Hinske, Gross) gives each more ABs and Haynes is simply a defensive fill-in/reserve, something he probably is more suited for than Ruggiano is.

I am not arguing that Haynes is good or that the Rays should keep him, only that it is premature to judge, that he may serve a useful purpose and that he should definitely not be made into the scapegoat or “most hated player” the way Camp was and others have been unfairly.

Yes, I am. I think he was sabotaged by a terrible infield. I want to stress that he also made some of his own trouble last year by losing the plate too often and making some bad pitches, but his control problem particularly was out of character with the rest of his career. He was not a good pitcher by any stretch of the imagination, but he was not measurably worse than Glover for example and just as likely to be useful in the right circumstances. No loss that he is gone, but he was not the reason the Rays were so bad last year, and he was about league average the year before.

I saw one game last year that summed up both his own weaknesses and that of the team. He entered a game with one out and 2 runners on base. I do not remember the sequence but I do know that he gave up 2 double play ground balls, both playable, that went through for hits. Had either one been played, he was a hero. He also walked a batter and gave up a solid line drive single to right letting in both inherited runners and one of his own while getting only one out. So he was booed off the mound.

Back to the topic of this thread, Christina Karl (subscription only) at BP reviews the Gross trade from both sides and is enthusiastic about his chances to contribute to the Rays. An encouraging read.

What I also found interesting is her comments on replacing Gross with Gwynn Jr. in Milwaukee. I think it ok to quote that small portion;

“As for swapping in a reserve outfielder who can hit for one who doesn’t really—famous timely triple aside—but makes for a nice pinch-runner and defensive replacement… well, that isn’t really an apples-to-apples exchange. It’s more a matter of taste and which of the two player’s discrete skills best complement those of the regulars.”

I think that also applies to the brouhaha over keeping Haynes in TB.