6/19: CHC (45-27) at RAYS (42-29)
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 5:32 PM EDT
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PrintChicago Cubs at Tampa Bay Rays, Jun 19, 2008 7:10 PM EDT
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MVP = Shields
New Lineup
Aki – 2B
CC – LF
BJ – CF
Hinske – 1B
Longo – SS
Floyd – DH
Aybar – 3B
Navi – C
Gross – RF
www.citadel-insurance.com
I can't imagine they'd call him up to take a few reps from Aki.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions
He'd have to take the place of someone else on the roster.
So that wouldn’t work.
www.citadel-insurance.com
Anyone see the thing on Garza before the game on Fox?
He looked like a retarded Vanilla Ice.
www.citadel-insurance.com
Our 1st baseman other then Pena
Have no idea when to go after those groundballs
Hey, Pena's back tomorrow.
So I’m guessing Ruggiano has his bags packed.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 7:18 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not that hard.
Before the pitch you look where your 2B is. Aki should be letting him know as well. I’ve coached 15 year olds that have more common sense playing first than Aybar has.
www.citadel-insurance.com
Wonder if Percival is available tonight
I wouldnt want to see him even if he is
I went to the Dusty Baker School for Handling Pitchers
I don’t pay attention to pitch counts.
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That was a great throw
But does anyone else think CC has slowed down this year a bit? I mean, how many infield hits does he have compared to usual?
Last year he had 8% of his hits as IFH, this year 2.5%
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
RJ, where do you find some of these stats?
I’ve been looking around and could find any…
He's made his living on defense.
Nichols’ Law of Catcher Defense
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Orlando's Brighthouse sucks
Get DirecTV, or wait for AT&T U-verse
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
by Orlando Rays on Jun 19, 2008 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions
I take it back
Forget AT&T U-verse, unless your neighborhood will be FTTP. Our neighborhood’s U-verse take the fiber to the premises.
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
by Orlando Rays on Jun 19, 2008 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions
won’t take, that is
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
by Orlando Rays on Jun 19, 2008 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Hung that one up
Two on, no out
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
They need to make this guy...
throw his breaking stuff for strikes and attack his FB
Derrek Lee = Epic Fail
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
1-0 Rays!
Productive DP
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
Navy hit
I’m calling it
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
fuck
i mean i wasn’t gonna be shocked if we were held scoreless there but still could of done so much more than 1 run
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
by Orlando Rays on Jun 19, 2008 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, there goes that walk.
Aki >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Fuk-u-do-me
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
No
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
by Orlando Rays on Jun 19, 2008 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I also heard
He has Panda skin underwear and looking to buy a jock made of Bald Eagle feathers.
www.citadel-insurance.com
Shields isnt as sharp as I'd like
Long layoffs can do that
Can we PLEASE have a 1-2-3 inning?
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
First eight hitters
Are batting over .290 for the Cubs. 1-2-3’s are gonna be hard to come by.
www.citadel-insurance.com
He's probably available...
He hasnt thrown a ton of pitches like Percival…definitely not as many stressful pitches
RJ, doesn’t it seem weird that Beltre has an OOZ of 42, best in the league for 3rd basemen, but an RZR of .667 (one of the worst in the league)?
9 = 8
Yes, which is why I'd urge people to not take any one defensive metric too strongly into consideration.
Beltre is one of the top defenders at third.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I win, and a couple more weeks of this...
I’ll stop calling Carl overrated, and just call him garbage. This is getting ridiculous. That was a brutal swing.
How does OOZ work if they are playing the shift? is that like a free OOZ for the shortstop when Pena/Giambi etc ground into the shortstop playing 2nd?
9 = 8
if are dropping Ruggs for Pena
Then I really think this team should call up Brignac or at least Zobrist/Elliot Johnson. Evan Longoria should just stay at 3B and win his gold glove.
Make this bum work.
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
Beckham
Was soooo polite, it will be a shame if the minors eventually turn him into a Young or Dukes type. I don’t see that happening though.
I love this Shields
sometimes he just goes out there and looks like a true ace. Let’s see if he can carry us to a sweep.
and there is what would happen
if Longo had CC’s patience
by JMB on Jun 19, 2008 8:14 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
My wife and I just brought in the newest Rays Fan into the world.....
And if he’s not we’ll disown him
ty ty very much....
our 3rd boy. I tried to convice my wife to let us have enough to field our own time
Shields can go 115 pitches tonight with the time he's had off
Hopefully that means at least 8, maybe 9
congrats!
make sure he becomes a diehard Rays fan and tell him early, before anyone else can take him otherwise that the Red Sox are evil and Coco Crisp is actually Hitlers cousin.
Lingering sympathy pang?
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
by Orlando Rays on Jun 19, 2008 8:25 PM EDT up reply actions
That's what you call hot-shotted.
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
Tampa regional manager. He's the guy you go to if you win $600 to $125,000
Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.
by Orlando Rays on Jun 19, 2008 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Anyone know the game attendance?
I wish I was at the pit. Anyone go to either of the Cubs games? Atmosphere seems surreal at times
hmmm
So what will be the excuse from the STILL non believers if we sweep the Cubs?
That Soriano would of been enough to sweep us? I think the Rays will need to hold the world series trophy up before anyone actually believes they are good
yankees
don’t worry me at all. They don’t have Wang. Hughes will be out til September and showed nothing anyway. Kennedy will be back soon but looked horrible as well. They also have a weak pen with Joba in the rotation.
6 of those 7 wins come against the Astros and Padres. Not impressed.
and cuz I like saying it…... they don’t have wang /immature
Brignac's playing second tonight, but probably 2011 at the earliest.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions
To quote Rob Neyer
I don’t set the rosters, I just make fun of the guys who do.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Carl has growing to do
If he wants to be anything more than someone who is very dedicated to his job, and actually have success, he can’t keep swinging at every flippin’ pitch. He had the hitter’s count…work it into your favor…ugghh
by raysfaninminnesota on Jun 19, 2008 8:40 PM EDT reply actions
RATW mentioned a Claudell Washington comp, that works.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions
comparison in regards to patience at plate?
stats seem pretty comparable, with Carl having more speed for sb and triples…maybe better defense…i’m not that up on claudell washington to say too much
by raysfaninminnesota on Jun 19, 2008 8:45 PM EDT up reply actions
He's tried, Carl ignores the advice, he's admitted so in the papers.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions
shields needs to get into a fight every year
I’m loving the post-fight results, but about that right hook…
by raysfaninminnesota on Jun 19, 2008 8:43 PM EDT reply actions
touche
i suppose i wanted to focus on the post-suspension part
by raysfaninminnesota on Jun 19, 2008 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Hopefully we get to the cubs bullpen.
I know we have sucked with risp and men on tonight but apparently thats nothing new for Gallagher. WHNZ announcers said he has a .100 something avg against with runners on this year.
Beckham
Is supposedly more ready than most HS players but it will still be 2-3 years. Of course if we can have a 20 year old at SS in 2010, I don’t think we will complain. It probably moves Brignac to 2B as 3B and SS are obviously not long term options but I am more concerned of when/if Brignac shows he even deserves to start.
Brignac may playing 2B since we have no backup MIF’s(not counting Longoria) and Iwamura will be suspended soon and Bartlett is hurt. If they are ready to give him a call, he could be an option for a few days, I suppose.
Zobrist/Cannizaro say hi.
Unless we just want to start trying Reid out for a trade.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions
oh man
Shields and Kazmir can just be so dominant at times and I think Garza will be there soon. Price and everyone else…...I can’t stop talking about this team.
we need one more veteran hitter
someone with patience perhaps that can maybe help influence others
by raysfaninminnesota on Jun 19, 2008 8:48 PM EDT reply actions
fuck
I really thought Floyd was gonna hit one of his rockets there. Need another great inning from Shields.
trevor miller doesnt feel good
when trevor miller is pitching
by EminenceFront on Jun 19, 2008 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Percy and Howell arent available
Well, I love when Howell pitches. We need to only use Balfour and Wheeler tonight.
i wasn't even waiting, i just checked woot, refreshed a couple times, and BAM!
i got a 2GB sansa player w/ headphones, a broken external DVD drive, and a $30 graphics card.
Why is the infield in in the 7th inning?
Especially with a man on 2nd…
Balfour needs to make sure he pauses before he pitches
He just balked
Watch CC for that...Upton plays with a smooth demeanor which makes him appear casual
He just made a mistake by taking his eye off the ball
Not enough people have titles of Who songs as their screennames.
by JI on Jun 19, 2008 9:22 PM EDT up reply actions
I still don't know how you mixed up "l" with "r" on the keyboard.
And I just set you up for a Graham ethnicity joke.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions
ROFLMAO
Chairman Mao that is….
/here all week
by EminenceFront on Jun 19, 2008 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions
i got excited for a second
I thought Marmol got hurt and our asses were saved but he was just tying his shoes…..
J.P. Ricciardi is the only person besides you to not like Adam Dunn.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions
That seems like an odd person to dislike Adam Dunn
Thom Breneman would murder Dunn if it were legal to do so.
by JI on Jun 19, 2008 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions
He strikes out a ton. Doesn’t hit anything but home runs. Sucks in the field. And is a lazy asshole. So yeah.
No
His defense is so horrific that he’s basically not worth giving up anything of value unless he DHs. Plus he has sizable home/road splits: his numbers are going to drop a bit moving to the AL, and moving out of Cincinnati.
by JI on Jun 19, 2008 9:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd take him if I didn't give up anyone that I'd miss.
by JI on Jun 19, 2008 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd sign him, just not to the massive contract he'll get.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Sure he is better than Hinske/Gomes/Floyd/Gross 4 headed monster.
But that doesn’t make him more than just an average major leaguer.
I have a feeling that the Reds see him as a star because of his HR production
and they’re going to want more then what he’s worth. They may just settle for a draft pick.
by JI on Jun 19, 2008 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions
When he makes contact he is great
But his defense is pretty bad. Besides I never said I didn’t really like him. I said I don’t like one dimensional players like Dunn. I prefer well rounded players. I like guys with high average with medium pop and good speed. Frankly your lover, BJ Upton, is the type of player I love. I hate extremely high k guys especially when they are unable to make contact in situations that require contact.
Most players are one dimensional
and it’s important to remember that not all dimensions are created equal. Dunn is still a productive bat, but I wouldn’t sign him to a LT deal or deal any elite talent for him.
by JI on Jun 19, 2008 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions
He has his uses for sure.
On this team I wouldn’t want him because we already have enough guys that strike out a ton. But on certain teams he would be a strong asset.
So you'd rather have players that ground out more, and produce fewer runs?
by JI on Jun 19, 2008 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions
When you have a team with a low OBP but tons of HR hitters you just end up with lots of solo shots. I’d like some contact hitters that can move people out, hit sac flies. You know the things we keep failing at when we have a man on 3rd with 1 out. Guys that strike out constantly really hurt you in those scenarios.
They are
See Ichiro, see Fukodome, and now see Iwamura
Gross has his moments
But he is a marginal player at best. He has his uses. Even Gross knows what type of player he is (see his comments on his abilities vs lefties).
CC is not marginal. He may not be a mega superstar, but he is a star. Since you guys live and die with 1 statistic you fail to see the value in CC. I actually find it pretty hilarious.
EqA, OBP, P/PA, O-Swing%, OPS+ are all one stat.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Is double posting included in that?
I look at the big picture. I include things like runs and stolen bases. Two things you obviously ignore. It is okay though. We are both happy when CC does more things that you like.
More often than not at the
plate this season he has
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
That's the way
we roll!!!!!!!!!!!!
We finally regress someone this series!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
Sweep!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I love this team
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
Regressing
2 guys in the same inning is fun!!!!!!!!!!!
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
oh my god
blowing the lead turned into the greatest thing. It showed just how fucking fun this team can be
From RJ: I fuckiI fucking love B.J. time
Me too RJ, me too. Oh wait, are we talking about the same thing here? LOL
no subject
i guess i should explain this further,
for those who aren’t watching on tv.
the grand slam by carl was only the 2nd swing of the inning
by god allah star on Jun 19, 2008 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Eyre's
ERA went from .87 to 3.38 this inning and it’s not over. Regressing is fun.
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
Anyone going to the games this weekend?
I’ll be there Friday and Saturday. I can’t go to weekday games so I missed this entire series.
the best part is
how we made Carlos Marmol, probably the best SU man in baseball look worse than Gary Glover ever has.
4 more!
I am not even worried, Rays will not be dumb enough to demote Glover instead of releasing Glover when Reyes returns
Well there is a reason why we keep seeing Balfour in tough situations
Maddon likes what he sees. And there is a reason why we never see the Glove.
wow
he would make a good closer. did what Marmol couldn’t do with the lead. challenged them…and he won.
3 more outs til a sweep!
Hello from Omaha! Gotta love June thunderstorms in the Midwest. Not really.
I can’t believe I’ve missed this entire series, dammit.
Oh and congrats to LL on the M’s house cleaning. The removal of Naimoli and LaMar were among the greatest days of Rays fandom.. until this season.
I swear to god, I’ll throw RJ’s chair through a wall if Glover keeps his job over Balfour.
Longlorious.
damn you
i had to buy Men At Work with my Zunepass now…
by EminenceFront on Jun 19, 2008 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions
i have the LP though
i can haz ch33zburger?
by EminenceFront on Jun 19, 2008 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions
One good game doesnt negate an entire season
He needs to change his approach to become the player we think he is capable of becoming
2 months doesn't negate an entire career
it happens.
he’ll make adjustments and be fine.
by god allah star on Jun 19, 2008 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Nobody is arguing he won't be fine, but at this midpoint of the year he's sucked.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions
i don't know that he's sucked
but he has been better.
but jumping on him after 2 months isn’t very nice,
in my humble opinion.
by god allah star on Jun 19, 2008 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think he has done significantly worse than Upton
Prior to this game he has significantly less K’s, more runs, almost as many SB (but less CS), more triples, now he is tied in HR, slightly less in RBIs even though he is hitting 2nd. Sure Upton has done better, but CC hasn’t done that bad. But have underachieved, but neither has been horrible. Plus Upton has 3 more errors now.
Yes, yes he has done signifcantly worse than Upton.
I’ll beg of you to not make stupid comments like that.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions
In your opinion
And you are wrong in my opinion. I look at more than just OPS. The fact is Crawford is stealing, scoring, and driving in runs at essentially the same clip as Upton.
And SLG% and OBP%
Are much larger factors in a teams success. It has been statistically proven. CC fails on both accounts.
So instead of
.283 .368 .440 you want .266 .312 .369
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Upton has NO
control over who’s on base when he gets a hit or who gets a hit when he’s on base. RBI’s and Runs scored are how they judged players in 1975, not 2008. Sorry. I’m not a “stat-head.” In fact, if you look at my sig, you’ll see that I’ve been called a “tools whore”, but your argument is stupid
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
Actually
Perhaps if BJ stopped getting caught stealing at almost a very high clip he would score more runs?
You really can't believe some of the stuff you type..
To even compare CC and BJ’s season’s is beyond ludicrous
I really don’t think you watch the games. Do you just look at a few ratios post game to determine how someone played?
Please watch the games.
BJ has screwed up numerous times in CF due to laziness. He strikes out a boatload more. He makes boneheaded moves on the base paths. And CC has nearly the exact same counting stats as BJ. BJ has a higher OPS due to walks and doubles. Congrats. In my book that doesn’t make his season that much better.
Have you applied
recently been fired from a GM position in the Pacific Northwest?
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
by Tyler on Jun 19, 2008 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I watch the games and played at a relatively high level...
These 2 guys arent even close stats, or no stats
Yep...
Defense, base running, and scoring aren’t relevant in the game of baseball. Yep you are right.
You are an idiot
Studies have proven OPS is a far greater indicator of producing runs then BA
You're the guy...
That would say the Royals are the best team in baseball because their winning % is .682 on Thursday afternoon games. You pick out stats of little relevance these days, and ignore more statistically relevant things
No
I take everything into account. I use more than just OPS. Heck I actually pay attention to what makes up their OPS. It seems like some of you just see a number and recite it like it is gospel without really knowing what is behind it.
That's asinine
Upton’s SB% is 71%. That’s not amazing, but it’s pretty good. And he gets on base 9% more that CC does.
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
I wouldn't call 71 percent good...
BJ will improve. The point being is you stat heads ignore parts of the game such as getting caught stealing. To you it doesn’t matter if someone gets caught 1 time or 100 times as long as they have a high OPS. I look at the bigger picture.
70% is the cutoff line. Thanks for playing.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not a stat head
just educated
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
Are you seriously asking
Does getting more XBH and walking more make him extremely better than a singles hitter who hacks?
No that was not what I was asking.
Clearly I was pointing out that CCs numbers are superior except for the walks and doubles. The difference is basically the walks and doubles. In your book the fact that BJ strikes out, commits errors, and gets caught stealing does not in any way balance out the fact BJ walks more and hits more doubles.
OPS meh
i’d still take carls season so far over justin uptons,
who has a significantly higher ops.
by god allah star on Jun 19, 2008 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions
And I'd be willing to bet my
entire years earnings that you couldn’t find 2 MLB GM’s that would agree with you.
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
uh, yeah?
that carls performance, so far, this season,
is better than justin uptons?
completely disregarding potential, only talking about performance through today?
by god allah star on Jun 19, 2008 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions
This season?
Justin Upton is far better.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Gets on-base more, hits for more power.
by R.J. Anderson on Jun 19, 2008 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions
but
he’s probably on pace to strikeout 200 times.
OBP is huge, i agree,
but if every GM thought it was the end all be all,
hatteberg would have a job somewhere
by god allah star on Jun 19, 2008 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, but Hatteburg doesn't slug
Especially not for his position. He is a decent ballplayer, but not worth blocking a good young player. Hell, even Dusty Baker could see that.
What adjustments will he make?
Will he all of a sudden become a patient hitter? Will he become faster?
He might... But his OBP wont be good...
Hopefully his SLG can improve
he'll hit .300
crawford has always been a streaky hitter…he’ll get his average up, but at this point, when he’s supposed to be entering the prime of his career, with the yearly improvements, Carl had the capability to be a top 5 player in all of baseball, and what might be happening, is his ceiling may not be quite as high as we hoped…doesn’t make him a bad player, just not as good as we thought he might be
by raysfaninminnesota on Jun 19, 2008 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions
good point
love him for what he is,
not what you want him to be.
by god allah star on Jun 19, 2008 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Normally I would agree
But we dont want Wheeler to have to come in
I saw the7th and eighth
Just was trying to catch up on the posts. I gave up though cause I wanted to see what was goin on now…
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