DRaysBay: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:



Around SBN: Phillies trade for OF Matt Stairs Bar-right-arrows



Where Have All the Sluggers Gone?

A changing of the guard has come faster then we could of ever imagined. In less then 4 years we have lost Sosa, Palmeiro,Piazza and Bonds. I again ask the question where have all the sluggers gone? Seems to me they took the roids and ran. Now there is a young group of players doing it the right way and playing baseball the way it has meant to be played. This is my ALL MASHER team AL and NL versions. Come up with your own I encourage you. Remember this is based on offensive skills so do not redicule me for my picks. The teams do include some vets who are still doing it as well. I am not playing favorites. A player must have had a decent season prior as well even if in only limited play.

AL

lf Manny Ramirez
cf Josh Hamilton
rf Jermaine Dye
1b Justin Morneau
2b Ian Kinsler
ss Derek Jeter
3b Alex Rodriguez
c Jorge Posada
dh Milton Bradley

NL

lf Pat Burrell
cf Rick Ankiel
rf Ryan Ludwick
1b Albert Pujols
2b Chase Utley
ss Hanley Ramirez
3b Chipper Jones
c Bryan McCann
p Carlos Zambrano

 

 

 

0 recs | Comment 31 comments

Story-email Email | Print |

Comments

Display:

Some of the big sluggers have either just retired (going to) or are getting pretty old. Barry Bonds was the premier HR hitter and he is blackballed out of baseball. There is no way to know if he would still be able to hit HRs at a comparable pace to his career track record.

by matthan on Jun 27, 2008 9:22 AM EDT   0 recs

More pitchers have been caught with steroids or other PHD than hitters. How many of Bonds’s homers (or anyone else’s) came off of pitchers who were throwing 5 MPH harder than they otherwise would be?

Also, I nominate Vlad Guerrero for RF instead of Dye; J-Bay in right instead of Ludwick; perhaps Coors-inflated Holliday in left. Or Carlos Lee? Micah Owings instead of Zambrano. And CC Sabathia for the AL?

by Peter Bendix on Jun 27, 2008 9:48 AM EDT   0 recs

I did not pick Guerrero because he is a DH most of the time, J Bay plays left field if I remember correctly. If you check the .OPS Pay Burrell has the highest in LF the last 2 years in the NL not counting Hollidays inflated Coors stats. Zambrano is a better hitter then Owings and a switch hitter. Sabathia would be my pick too if the AL let pitchers hit on a regular basis. Almost makes a case for him to pitch in the NL next year.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 27, 2008 10:02 AM EDT   0 recs

Zambrano .234/.241/.369 career; Owings .299/.349/.532.

Vlad has 203 at bats as a right fielder this year, 66 at bats as a designated hitter.

If you’re talking pure slugging, I’d say that Braun or Dunn should be in left, not Burrell. Incidentally, up until this year Burrell has had a higher OPS at home than on the road – last year Burrell’s OPS at home was 1.016 and on the road it was 794.

You’re right about Bay playing left field, though.

by Peter Bendix on Jun 27, 2008 10:27 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I would say that the AL’s outfielders are alot better than the NL’s(offensively). But the NL’s infielders look to be better this year.

by Raysfan2bb on Jun 27, 2008 10:09 AM EDT   0 recs

I take Ryan Braun over Pat Burrell.

by zrays on Jun 27, 2008 10:48 AM EDT   0 recs

Lamar

I would take Barry Bonds over Ryan Braun if he were playing still.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 27, 2008 10:56 AM EDT   0 recs

Not me, and I am a big Bonds guy...

Maybe when it was still this Barry…

by rglass44 on Jun 27, 2008 11:11 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I thought long and hard about Braun but he clearly has not found a position. He was 3b last year if you remember. I also thought about perhaps even picking Berkman or Ryan Howard over Pujols. In the NL it was touch choices all the way around. However Bonds production at 350 ABs logged more walks and had a higher OBP then anyone at the league. Imagine those stats on a AL club would nearly double.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 27, 2008 11:59 AM EDT   0 recs

Japhei, you from NY by any chance?

Jeter? Posada? Are we talking “Mashers?” Career or present?

I’ve got to say this. If you are from NY, you nailed it at 3B. Alex Rodriguez is the best there is, the best there was, the best there ever will be. He’s a baseball God. He’ll hit 800+ HR’s for his career barring serious injury.

At SS Michael Young flat out hits the snot off the ball. HR power? Jhonny Peralta in Cleveland has some moonshots that still haven’t come down in his bat. Jetes IMO, is the most over-rated player in MLB. He fell into a great situation. If he’d had started his career in TB he might have been out of the league many moons ago.

To choose Jorge Posada over Joe Mauer? What’s the world coming to? If you are looking at career numbers Ivan Rodriguez will be enshrined in the H.O.F. 5-seasons after retiring. O.K. I’m ridiculing. So those are my choices at those positions.

I also looked at 1B. If we’re talking longball I’d nominate Carlos “jala” Pena. Last season was just fabulous to watch. I kept waiting for Carlos to stop hitting the long ball and he never did.

by John 63 on Jun 27, 2008 12:01 PM EDT   0 recs

Alex Rodriguez is the best there is, the best there was, the best there ever will be.

We’re talking about A-Rod, not Bret Hart.

Do not think that what is hard for you to master is humanly impossible; but if a thing is humanly possible, consider it to be within your reach.

by Orlando Rays on Jun 27, 2008 12:44 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Brett Hart?

At least get it right if you’re going to ridicule me (T.I.C.) The statement above comes from none other than the high fly’n, prifile’n, limosine ride’n, son-of-a-gun himself! Rick Flair

Now for the next tidbit of trivia. Who am I?

"They are who we thought they were."

by John 63 on Jun 28, 2008 8:07 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Dennis Green

We let em off the hook!

Crown ‘em

by rglass44 on Jun 30, 2008 10:13 AM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Jetes is the best SS of my generation

He is one of the greatest hitting SS of all time. Granted the media plays up his defense (which is at best below average and downright terrible other times), his “leadership,” etc. but that’s how it is when you play for the greatest franchise in the history of sports. I hate Jeter as much as anyone but to say “If he’d had started his career in TB he might have been out of the league many moons ago” is the height of exaggeration.

by rglass44 on Jun 27, 2008 1:01 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

A-Rod is the best SS of your generation

But I agree with everything else you said.

by GomesSweetGomes on Jun 27, 2008 2:02 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah

I was wondering how to count him. By the time he retires, he will likely have played more games at 3B than at SS. He would have been the best SS ever had he stayed there, but the switch may make him the best SS and 3B ever.

by rglass44 on Jun 27, 2008 2:29 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Actually I am from Baltimore. I did not choose any of these players by name only by performance. I calculated this year and last OPS and went with the most consistent even in limited playing time. If you look back the past few years Posada has a higher OPS and Jeter has the best in the AL the past 3 seasons. Rodriguez is a gimme.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 27, 2008 12:13 PM EDT   0 recs

OPS does not equal slugging.

Jeter has a high OBP and low slugging, for example.

by Peter Bendix on Jun 27, 2008 12:35 PM EDT   0 recs

To me OPS matters most if you are a slugger means you are feared and you get on base. A guy who hits 15 home runs and 50 doubles is more important then a guy who hits 30 home runs and 20 doubles. I would take 65 extra base hits over 50.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 27, 2008 12:40 PM EDT   0 recs

I see your point about more extra base hits being better, but it’s not an either/or. The guy with 65 XBHs still could have a lower OBP than the guy with 50, depending on how many singles/walks the other guy gets.

If you’re truly trying to measure sluggers, OPS is not the way to go. If you want to measure productivity, OPS is pretty good. Jeter, for example, is productive, but not a slugger.

by Peter Bendix on Jun 27, 2008 12:46 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

If we were going on pure slugging alone Russell Branyan would be in the mix certainly. Adam Dunn a pure gimme. Dan Uggla Jason Giambi so many one dimensional players its not even funny. Jorge Cantu , Mike Jacobs . Most of the Marlins LMAO.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 27, 2008 12:42 PM EDT   0 recs

If we want to measure sluggers, let’s use ISO.

For this season alone, ISO leaders, by position:

AL
C- AJ Pierzynski
1B- Jason Giambi
2B- Ian Kinsler
SS- Jhonny Peralta
3B- Alex Rodriguez
LF- Carlos Quentin
CF- Josh Hamilton
RF- JD Drew
DH- Milton Bradley

NL
C- Brian McCann
1B- Lance Berkman
2B- Dan Uggla
SS- Hanley Ramirez
3B- Mark Reynolds
LF- Pat Burrell
CF- Nate McLouth
RF- Ryan Ludwick

Over the past three years the list would be:

AL
C- Mike Napoli (Jorge Posada second)
1B – Carlos Pena
2B- Ian Kinsler
SS- Carlos Guillen (Juan Uribe second, then Jhonny Peralta Peralta)
3B- Alex Rodriguez
LF- Marcus Thames
CF- Josh Hamilton
RF- Jermaine Dye

NL
C- Brian McCann
1B- Ryan Howard
2B- Chase Utley
SS- Hanley Ramirez
3B- Ryan Braun (then Russell Branyan, then Chipper Jones)
LF- Ryan Braun (then Barry Bonds, then Adam Dunn)
CF- Cody Ross
RF- Ken Griffey Jr

by Peter Bendix on Jun 27, 2008 1:06 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

pitching numbers are up, power numbers are down

and 50 HR is truly a magnificent acomplishment for any hitter. 5 years ago that was not true, and hitting 50+ HR wasnt as big of an accomplishment. NOw we can see from the years before the steroid boom, and the last couple of years since it has ended that hitting 50+ HR is VERY difficult naturally

by blazinrayz on Jun 28, 2008 1:31 AM EDT   0 recs

The steroid boom started because of ...

The steroid boom started because of one man who never did steroids. Cecil Fielder! He came back into the league after a year in japan and failings with the blue jays to club 51 home runs . I am sure this is what sparked the steroid hysteria among players most notably the bash bros. Of which Jose Canseco took his knowledge and spread it to the Texas Rangers players like Juan Gonzalez and Rafael Palmeiro. They realized the home run was bigger then baseball at that moment and made a effort to top him at all costs. It was then McGwire’s power numbers along with Sosa that drove Bonds to start using as well. Do not consider this a theory but actual fact. It all Started with CECIL FIELDER. And I doubt he ever took one steroid.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 28, 2008 9:44 AM EDT   0 recs

I dunno...

McGwire and Canseco were putting up huge HR numbers before Big Cec. I’d be willing to bet they were much more influential. It also seemed much more possible to turn into Canseco than Cecil. Brian Downing is also someone to credit. He made weightlifting acceptable.

by tallyray on Jun 28, 2008 7:28 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Really?

As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball.

by acblue on Jun 29, 2008 11:05 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I think

I think early in their careers Canseco and McGwire did it legit. But I think that after injuries took a toll on their bodies they used steroids to keep helthy and in many ways that ruined them faster as they broke down really fast at the end of their careers. Neither one had hit 50 home runs although McGwire was close his rookie season. Still both players were one dimensional. Singles or Homers. At least Canseco got steals although he did look awkward running the bases with all those muscles.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jun 30, 2008 11:23 AM EDT   0 recs

I thought Canseco said his '88 wouldn't have been possible without roids...

Plus, HR’s peaked in the AL in 1987 and then again in 1996.

I just don’t see how Cecil started anything. Cecil was a player that no one imagined they could be. He was enormous. I don’t think anyone went up to Cecil and asked “What’s your secret?”. It was obvious how he was hitting homeruns. Canseco and McGwire were different cases. Cecil Fielder did make it possible for players like Calvin Pickering and Walter Young.

by tallyray on Jun 30, 2008 12:25 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Cecil Fielder made it possible for players like Prince Fielder, Frank Thomas, and Adam Dunn. Natural big power.

Devil Rays World Series 2009

by Japhei on Jul 1, 2008 9:45 AM EDT   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Founded in February 2005

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

David_price_the_messiah_small
This is Garza Sign: The Remix....
Small
Cheers and Jeers for Tampa Bay Fans.
Small
No Doubt About It: A Horsesh*t Call

Recent FanPosts

Curlys-crew_small
FANTASY MLB TRANSACTIONS
Nolan_ryan_small
Got To Be Kidding Me
Amd_brawl_small
EJax in the stretch
Small
Oh Where'd you go Billy-O?
Small
MLB, umpire: Call against Aybar was wrong
Princeton02_small
Orioles vs. Rays
Logo_small
If you build it, they will come.
Small
Is there a conspiracy against the Rays??

Post_icon New FanPost All FanPosts Carrot-mini

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recent FanShots

Obviously not concerned about potential tampering charges, the Yankees'...
Fan loses eye after being hit by ball
Sox-Sawx matchup
New website
Pennant Fever? Not Here
Question of the day: What are the Rays chances of winning 100 games? Any...
Projected 2008 Elias Player Ratings
Brian Fuentes is put on waivers!
Replay coming Friday to Trop
Vero Beach Devil Rays to Port Charlotte official

Post_icon New FanShot All FanShots Carrot-mini


Editors-in-Chief

Patavatar_small Patrick L. Kennedy

Maddonbearlo3_small R.J. Anderson

Associate Editor

Img_0143_small SaberToothedPie

ad

Site Meter