Little League?

by pontormo on Aug 14, 2008 6:59 PM EDT Comment 28 comments

Today is a perfect example of why Upton (and Crawford) drive me crazy. A little league baserunning error in the first, but a gamewinning (hopefully, (two outs in the ninth inning as I write this) hit in the 9th. Ahhhhhhh! Good fortune to get Percival out of the lineup for awhile--perfect transition to Balfour as the permanent closer? Oh well, extra innings. I still think Percival should go on the permanent DL. Walking the leadoff batter in the 9th with a one run lead is just not acceptable, and he has done it a lot.

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Yeah its starting to get a little rediculous...

…it seems like it’s every night with BJ.
I love Balfour, but his pitches are so straight. Reminds me a lot of e-jax’s pitches.
Very hittable if you can catch up to them (big if).
Hopefully we can pull this one out in extras

by TampaRayNation on Aug 14, 2008 7:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, screw B.J., lazy hack. WHY DO YOU WALK SO MUCH GUY?

by R.J. Anderson on Aug 14, 2008 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

STOP MAKING GAME SAVING CATCHES SHOW OFF. YOU THINK YOU'RE AN ALL-STAR? WELL, YOU'RE NOT.

by RATW on Aug 14, 2008 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

RJ

Your lack of objectivity here is concerning. Everyone knows you like BJ, but you are taking this apologetic behavior a bit too far. Just a bit of advice, when he screws up you should admit it instead of trying to spin it around. BJ does a lot of great things, but he also does a lot of bad things. You should acknowledge them here and there like you do for other players.

Just because other people are idiots and are acting like all BJ does is screw up doesn’t make it any better for someone to act like he is perfect. It is the sort of error just on the polar opposite side of the spectrum.

by matthan on Aug 15, 2008 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He has screwed up.

I’ve said this many times, but not as many times as some people would want to believe.

by R.J. Anderson on Aug 15, 2008 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

And many times you've resorted to the..

BJ is jesus christ and he should be inducted to the hall of fame point of view also.

by matthan on Aug 15, 2008 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

And you can prove that B.J. isn't Jesus?

He’s made some really stupid plays and he’s made some really great plays. At the end the really good plays outweigh the really stupid by quite a bit. I don’t dwell on mistakes.

by R.J. Anderson on Aug 15, 2008 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This is my objection

I have no problem with people pointing out specific mistakes in reviewing a particular game. What galls me is generalizing from the specific to characterizing Upton as lazy or unmotivated.

Even if someone thinks a player has not made an all-out effort, there is no way to know why that happened or whether a poor decision was because of lack of effort or any number of other factors. When a player strikes out looking and a fan attributes the K to some character flaw, that is character assassination and simply wrong.

But essentially, the problem is the generalizing from the specific case and assuming that one’s own observation of a pattern of mistakes is actually objective enough to be able to draw large scale conclusions about a player’s effort and motivation.

To related it specifically to Upton, he has made bonehead plays and has occasionally not appeared to give maximum effort. But that does not mean he is not dedicated or that he is lazy or not baseball smart any more than the fact that every one of us has made stupid decisions and therefore are stupid.

by bobr on Aug 15, 2008 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like how you make this thread today, but not when Aybar forgets the numbers of outs in an inning.

Leading to an inning ending double play.

by R.J. Anderson on Aug 14, 2008 8:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I actually like B.J.

off topic: Chinese judges have been contested by american commentators and gymnastics coach

They do it all with gills!

by LONGO4PREZ08 on Aug 15, 2008 12:32 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Boxing has been ridiculous

Maybe two of the Chinese boxers have deserved to advance, and the judging has been horrendous overall. Just as bad as 1988, which precipitated the scoring changes, except that the way they score it now it’s barely boxing.

Vogt early, Vogt often.

by Brickhaus on Aug 15, 2008 12:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jesus calm down

Is it too much to ask for a MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL PLAYER to hustle on every play. Just because he has more talent than most players doesn’t mean that he gets put in less effort. I dont care how good you are, you cant take plays off. Take Johnny Gomes for example. He plays hard every second he’s on that field to make up for his lesser talent. Imagine how good BJ could be if he played with the same intensity. I’m not saying hes not a good player, he obviously is great. But, you’re just stupid if you think he gives max effort.

Please explain to me why its all right for him to not run out ground balls…..

by TampaRayNation on Aug 15, 2008 12:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Because 95% of players don't run out every ground ball

Including other players on this team yet Upton always gets the full blunt of blame. No, he doesn’t go all out on every player, but if you really wanted you could make this post about just about any other player on any other team and it still applies.

by R.J. Anderson on Aug 15, 2008 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

EVAN LONGORIA STRIKES OU TOO MUCH.

"STP is me. He can do everything I can do." - R.J. Anderson

by P Brady on Aug 15, 2008 1:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I've made it clear Im a huge BJ Upton fan

and you will never see me crack on him on here, but I find it funny how you guys fail to stay on topic. It is your typical defense. You take the argument and turn it into something else. The guy made a good point, and as a BJ Upton lover I can admit that, but you choose to splinter this argument off into different tangents.

Longoria strikes out too much? Bj walks a lot? Aybar did what last night? What the hell does any of this have to do with the topic at hand?

To say that 95% of the league plays at BJs pace is flat out WRONG. BJ plays really lackadaisacally at times. There have been easily a handful of plays this year that may have been decided by BJs lack of intensity on the base paths. I dont think hes purposely not trying, which is why I dont have a huge problem with it. I think he sometimes thinks plays arent going to be close, instead of assuming every play that MIGHT be close will be close, and he loafs into an out that may have gone either way. I can forgive that, because I think it is something he will grow out of

Overall, I agree that BJ gets a raw deal from teh fans on most accounts. I dont think he is bad at runnign back on the ball, I dont think he jogs in the OF when he is taking long strides, I dont have any problem whatsoever with his overly aggressive arm in the OF. These are just a few of teh complaints Ive heard that are dead wrong IMO

by blazinrayz on Aug 15, 2008 3:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm sorry...

….for wanting more from my players.
Oh yea, it’s okay because most baseball players do it. Great argument.
You sure got me there…..

by TampaRayNation on Aug 15, 2008 4:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think you're missing the point

Nobody here believes that it’s ‘OK’ for a player to fail to run out a grounder. What people are sick of is the fact that fans single out BJ for this kind of behavior when he is far from the only culprit. If you want to have something against players not giving their all, more power to you. But to pretend that Iwamura, Floyd, Baldelli, and even GOMES are not guilty of this behavior is asinine.

by GomesSweetGomes on Aug 15, 2008 7:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly.

Like yesterday with the announcers ranting on running every ball in play yet where was that when Gabe Gross barely gets halfway down first on a flyball?

by R.J. Anderson on Aug 15, 2008 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

The difference

BJ Upton SHOULD be the heart and soul of this team. I don’t believe in all the hustle BS, but he now has been tagged as lazy. As, arguably, the best player on the team, he needs to take the responsibility to MAKE SURE he does everything he can every play. He should be the star of this team, but people see his attitude and judge. I think his “attitude” is swagger, and that is why he’s my favorite player. The issue, though, is that he NEEDS to set the tone and make sure that he makes every play, not just the ones he thinks he can make. One thing that I love about CC or Reyes or Gomez is that they make the defense nervous. A gapper to right-center should have him busting his ass to every bag so that when the CF gets to the ball he rushes it and maybe makes a mistake.

This is my only complaint about him. He has the best approach, he will be our best defensive OF, he is a game-changer, etc., but he could be that much better if he didn’t just put in the necessary but put in the extra-effort.

I’m going to go masturbate to Pete Rose now.

by rglass44 on Aug 15, 2008 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

How was i pretending

did i say that they run out every play?
Because I don’t remember doing that.
The only player i said that about is Gomes, and i dare you to prove me wrong.
You of all people should know how he plays. I wish every player on our team had his heart.

by TampaRayNation on Aug 15, 2008 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Do you realize the irony

of wishing all our players had the heart of a man that had a massive heart attack at 22 years old.

Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind.

by Sandy Kazmir on Aug 15, 2008 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah,

I forgot about that lol.

by TampaRayNation on Aug 15, 2008 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think it is awesome that these are the only complaints about

Beejus’ game. Things like running the bases can be learned over time. Things like proper routes in the OF come with experience. Things like having a great eye in the box and snapping wrists are natural talents that cannot be learned. Things like being respectful in the media and not showing up teammates are innate traits. THE GUY IS 23 YEARS OLD. The biggest complaints will come with age. Getting on base 38% of the time at 23 is simply amazing. Slugging .508 at 22 is something that WILL happen again.

Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind.

by Sandy Kazmir on Aug 15, 2008 12:14 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs