problem is our local guys almost crave for the storm to hit

A hurricane is like Moe’s birthday on the Three Stooges for a meteorologist

what have you been watching?

the ‘save’ itself is probably ony 20+ years

And the thread i’m sure asks while Percy is out

was created in 1959 by Jerome Holtzman and adopted as an official stat 10 years later. But the notion of assigned roles, particularly specializing to the extent of having one pitcher reserved almost exclusively for the ninth inning is much more recent. Generally I have seen in credited to LaRussa who tended to limit Eckersley to the 9th inning beginning in 1988 or so, and then only if the As had a small lead.

For most of history, there were not even official relievers. Starters like Mordecai Brown and Lefty Grove would relieve on days between starts. Allie Reynolds shifted back and forth between starting and relieving pretty regularly. By the 1960s, there were more defined relievers like Arroyo, Brosnan and others, but into the 1980s, the relievers often went 3, 4 or 5 innings and sometimes more. In a way, Maddon is using Howell and Hammel a bit like the Yankees used Dick Tidrow who might go 1/3 of an inning one game and 4 the next. I attended a game that Tidrow pitched 10 2/3 innings of relief.

I really do not understand the need for defined roles. The role of any pitcher is pretty much the same; get outs and do not let runs score. Roles, it seems to me, should be determined by situations. You don’t expect some pitchers to provide more than an inning or two of work, and you want your best pitcher available for the most crucial situations, and I suppose it is possible (probable even) that some pitchers are less capable of handling the pressure of the ninth inning than others are (although that skill is likely exaggerated).

But otherwise, I would like to see evidence that Wheeler is better used in the 8th with a 2 run lead than in the 6th of a tie game, or that it is better to use Salas in the 6th of a tie game than in the 8th with a 2 run lead. Why would the inning matter to either? Their job is to stop runs from scoring.

It seems to me that the notion of assigned roles is a self-fulfilling prophesy in that pitchers are raised to believe they need the security of knowing when they will be used because they have been taught to need it. And additionally it is a prestige and contract issue in that relievers labeled closers get more money in contracts and are highlighted in game stories. So a manager cannot bring a Rivera or Hoffman in the game in the 6th inning even if it makes sense to do so. The agent would scream, the pitcher would be angry and if it backfired, the manager would have no place to hide.

why such a rebellious attitude?

I too defended him on radio yesterday afternoon, but hard to rationalize what he did last night

/sarcasm

no chance for him

Percival scares me to death. Am just as happy if he stays injured.

what do you mean “you use him”? If he is an excellent reliever (let’s use that designation instead of closer for now), is it efficient usage to bring him in to start the 9th with a 3 run lead? Are we so afraid that lesser relievers will wilt under the pressure of preserving a 3 run lead for 1 inning?

But suppose the Yankees have a 1 run lead in the 7th, and the opposition has runners on 2nd and 3rd with no outs. Is it efficient usage to bring in your 2nd or 3rd best reliever then because you want to keep Rivera available in case he has to protect a lead in the 9th that is about to disappear? I suppose the manager would have to consider who is pitching for the other team and what the Yankees’ chances are of scoring more runs and plenty more. But paring it down to a simple decision, why are you not using your best reliever in the most pressing situation?

Girardi cannot even consider that. I think Maddon can, especially with Percival out. And given his recent struggles and the emergence of other relievers, it may even be possible to convince Percival to alter his expectations a la the recommendation of skyking162, especially as I doubt Percival has to worry about another contract. (He may be concerned with accumulating saves for a HOF run, I suppose, or for the satisfaction of passing other closers if any are close to him, but his avowed purpose is to help weld the team into one rather than individual purposes, so he might be amenable to sacrifice gracefully, if only to symbolize that concept.)