In The Land of The Shortstop, Reid Brignac Stands Tall
Note: The discrepancies between the Baseball Databank numbers and Baseball-Reference's numbers are larger than originally assumed. Take the following with a grain of salt, given I have no idea which is more accurate. It looks like B-Ref rounded the 6'2.5" players up to 6'3", where as my query did not, hence the confusion concerning a few heights mentioned.
Reid Brignac is fascinating to me. Perhaps I'm a sucker for a good story of redemption or maybe I just fall in love with guys who have something to prove to the masses, but Brignac has my eye. Everyone knows the story -- or will, watch for a FanGraphs post on him tomorrow -- about his offensive charge then offensive recession then sudden defensive explosion. Yet while checking the defensive numbers, it appears there was never a doubt he could play shortstop.
That's right, Brignac has always graded out as an average defender at his position at each step. Now you can debate the merit of TotalZone and such, but I have a theory on why we heard so much about a potential change in positions while Brignac was growing up.
You see, Brignac is 6'3" and plays shortstop. Those two things rarely mix. In the history of baseball, two players recorded at 6'3"* have played shortstop for at least 100 games during their career. You should be able to name one, the other is a bit more trivial, but still recent. Two hints:
One is baseball's "iron man" and the other is a coach for the Florida Marlins.
Cal Ripken Jr. and Andy Fox are the only two with at least 76 inches below them to last at shortstop for any amount of time. Here's the interesting thing though, the guys who are a touch below 6'3" (6.25 to be exact) are pretty impressive:
Derek Jeter, Troy Tulowitzki, Alex Rodriguez, Bobby Crosby, Hanley Ramirez.
If I asked you to name your prototypical modern day shortstop, you would almost definitely name Jeter, Tulo, A-Rod, and Hanley. If I asked this a few years ago Crosby most likely would be a choice as well. That's at least two future hall of famers, two all-stars, and one flame out. How many of them were talked about moving off their positions while in the minors? How many of them would've played shortstop 15 years ago? 20?
The two players that Brignac most closely profiles in physique are Jeff Huson and Virgil Stallcup. Let's hope he's better than either. Huson** was a career journeyman with two useful seasons for Texas in the early 90's and a bunch of useless seasons for Milwaukee, Seattle, and the Chicago Cubs. During his career he played short, second, third, first, DH and all three outfield positions. Elliot Johnson has a hero, and his name is Jeff Huson.
I'm not saying Brignac is the next Cal Ripken Jr. or Jeff Huson***, but I am saying the reports of his dismal defensive in the low-minors may have been greatly overstated based purely on stature. Does that affect his current day status? Absolutely not. It fails to affect his future status either, although it does give us a nice piece of history if Brignac manages to play in 96 more games at short throughout his career.
Tall shortstops may have been pigeonholed to third in earlier years based on the expectation of weight gain. Brignac likely didn't fill out like you would've expected a tall 18-year-old to fill out, and for that the expectations of where he can play have changed.
*The height measures are recorded in the Baseball Databank and rounded to the nearest inch. There are no 75.5 inch players, only 75 and 76. Is that incorrect? Probably, but there's no source with a centimeter by centimeter measure that's freely available. Plus, if the biggest issue here is with the amount of centimeters a guy stood, then I think we're good.
**Equally as amusing; Huson's full name: Jeffrey Kent Huson.
***Equally as coincidental; Huson played in the same game that Cal Ripken broke the consecutive games played streak. I'm pretty sure there are three categories where these two should be listed together: 1. Height, 2. Players of the last two decades, 3. Guys who played in that game. Huson bleeds grit:
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Comments
Baseball Reference and the Cube
list all 5 SSs you mention at 6’3", not 6’2" and Ripken at 6’4". J.J. Hardy is listed at 6’2".
I always thought that scouts tended to talk about players outgrowing shortstop because of body type and weight gain although I do remember some amazement at the time that Ripken could remain at SS as a 6’4" player. But I don’t remember any such concern for Jeter, possibly because he was slender.
by bobr on Mar 29, 2009 2:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Added a note at the beginning.
I’m not entirely sure which is correct and where either gets the data.
The weight concern plays with height. Brignac hasn’t exactly “grown” like the scouts likely expected as a teenager, at least not with the weight gain. I still wonder if there’s some height bias in play, similar to the 3B/2B debate.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 29, 2009 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Myself being 6'4....
I can guarentee you that Arod is taller then 6’2…. Having stood next to him, I was amazed how big he was. He is every bit of 6’3, and probably closer to 6’4.
by td32 on Mar 29, 2009 2:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Beat me to it
A-Rod is listed everywhere at 6’3", played 1272 games at SS.
RaysProspects.com
by DAM on Mar 29, 2009 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, fixed the issue.
My query was everyone EXACTLY 6’3" inches and above. Meaning 75.6 inches. Jeter and co. are listed at 75 inches, which is 6.25 feet. Round it, 6’3".
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 29, 2009 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
rodriguez has always looked very leggy and bulky up-top to me.
IMO he’s not built like an infielder nowadays.
by yeseggs on Mar 29, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How tall???
I don’t know (or care) how tall Brignac is….He hasn’t done anything that makes me beliveve that he will be playing in the Majors…. especially with the Rays!
Remember last years MVP, plus a #1 draft choice getting ready in the minors right now!
Good luck..Maybe him and Niemann can play one on one basketball for waterboy???
by Bud Lite on Mar 29, 2009 3:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Okay, again, cut it out with the added punctuation.
We don’t need “???” and “!!!” after every statement. That’s your third warning.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 29, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dude, that's just some people's informal writing style
At my old job, one of my bosses wrote like that in internal e-mails. It was kind of annlying.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on Mar 29, 2009 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jason Bartlett was not the MVP of the team last year. not even close.
Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.
by P Brady on Mar 29, 2009 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My third warning???
What are you going to do…have an original thought or something meaningful to say???
by Bud Lite on Mar 29, 2009 3:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Okay, seriously. Stop.
The guidelines are pretty clear when they say:
Use proper spelling, grammar, and capitalization. Using them will give your comments more credibility and make your comments easier to read. Paragraphs are your friend. Note: gameday threads are the exception.
I’ve pointed this out to you multiple times. This has nothing to do with the content of your comments outside of the overabundance of punctuation. That’s the problem. Now fix it.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 29, 2009 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Come on RJ, he just wants to get his point across!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.
by P Brady on Mar 29, 2009 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
RJ already has several thousand of those
Here and on Fangraphs, and he generously takes the time to respond to people’s questions on comments on every website he writes for on comments on. This is R.J.‘s website, not yours, and you should treat him and his readers with respect and use proper punctuation. It’s pretty clear you’re not looking to keep the comments civil, so this might not be the place for you.
by Decatur on Mar 29, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ok! Ok!
I’ll be good! But I still need more meaningful imput than how tall an eventual bench warmer is!
by Bud Lite on Mar 29, 2009 4:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
.
http://www.draysbay.com/2009/2/23/767324/the-2009-draysbay-season-p
http://www.draysbay.com/stories/archive
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 29, 2009 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
BRING DOWN THE BANHAMMER RJ!!!

Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on Mar 29, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dear Dave:
Your girl friend drinks too much!
by Bud Lite on Mar 30, 2009 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As a matter of fact,
it is a perfectly legitimate issue to consider. Scouts are very keen on describing body types and trying to project where they best fit. In almost every prospect report we read that a player may outgrow (or not) his position or may grow into a position. It is particularly apt regarding catchers (to wit the extensive discussions about Mauer), but also applies to shortstops and corner players.
As for Brignac being a bench warmer, it is useless to assert such things with no information or anything new to say about it. We all know he disappointed offensively in 2008, although there were elements of his offensive game that remained promising. And we also know that many were disappointed in his 2007 as well, although in that case he saw significant growth in important offensive categories.
As a 22 year old shortstop having his first taste of AAA, increasingly admired for his defensive skill, and still listed reasonably high on almost every prospect list, unless you have some special insight to discount the continued optimism about his prospects, I can’t see that you contribute anything to the discussion.
by bobr on Mar 29, 2009 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
More tall SS
First Last Height Weight
Andy Fox 6.33 205
Cal Ripken 6.33 225
Mike Morse 6.33 220
Ray Busse 6.33 175
Jason Smith 6.25 195
Ben Zobrist 6.25 200
Troy Tulowitzki 6.25 205
Andre Rodgers 6.25 200
Scott Sheldon 6.25 185
Derek Jeter 6.25 175
Jim Smith 6.25 185
B.J. Upton 6.25 180
Alex Arias 6.25 185
Jerry Gil 6.25 183
Gary Green 6.25 175
Scott Leius 6.25 195
Rene Gonzales 6.25 201
Virgil Stallcup 6.25 185
Roy Smalley 6.25 190
Tony Kubek 6.25 191
Hanley Ramirez 6.25 195
Alex Rodriguez 6.25 190
Dale Sveum 6.25 185
Jack Wallaesa 6.25 191
Bill Almon 6.25 190
Jose Arcia 6.25 170
Geoff Blum 6.25 195
Ron Hansen 6.25 200
Jeff Huson 6.25 180
Bobby Crosby 6.25 195
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 29, 2009 8:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
We have to remember that
on average ballplayers are taller and heavier than they used to be. At 6’2", 215 lbs, Ruth was huge in his era as was Cobb at 6’1". Mantle and Mays were both under 6’ and Aaron was just 6’ according to baseball-reference. So a 5’10-11" shortstop, such as Honus Wagner or later Alvin Dark or Vern Stephens, was not much smaller than the big sluggers. It makes sense that shortstops today would be proportionally bigger than their earlier counterparts.
It might be more meaningful to ask if the size difference between today’s shortstops and other position players is smaller than it used to be or is there something peculiar about the position that makes it more difficult for a taller player to succeed in any circumstance?
I still think the real issue is body type, whether natural changes as one leaves his teens make some players less flexible or a step slower laterally. Scouts (and statistical analysts as well) seem to make much of projecting whether certain body types will outgrow the position, or will grow into one. I have not seen that concern in regards to Brignac.
by bobr on Mar 30, 2009 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
New Idea for Website!
List how tall every prospect is!
That way we can best determine what position they are best suited for!
Guarantee it will be unique to baseball websites…
But I have seen some NBA sites with this information!
by Bud Lite on Mar 30, 2009 9:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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