Fun with Southpaws and Release Points

by R.J. Anderson on Apr 10, 2009 9:00 AM EDT

How far down does Shouse release a pitch?

More than a foot lower and to the left of Howell. Imagine being a lefty and going from Shouse to Howell in consecutive at-bats, or Howell to Shouse. Or anyone to Shouse. Not only are you adjusting your eye up or down, but also further away.

How about Kaz?

Kazz_medium

Granted that's a marginal difference and a random sample, but it will be interesting to see if that release point stays lower all season long.

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Comments

On Kaz: Extra muscle means less flexibility in the arm slot?

Also, am I the only one who didn’t really see a difference? 20lbs is a lot on someone who is less than 200lbs, it should be visible.

Check out my blog on web development at kericr.wordpress.com

by kericr on Apr 10, 2009 9:02 AM EDT reply actions

Regarding the size.

I think he looked a little thicker, but he may also have lost some of the mass when he was doing conditioning or just getting back into pitching. I imagine a lot of it was to his lower half too which wouldn’t be quite as noticeable.

by rglass44 on Apr 10, 2009 9:05 AM EDT up reply actions

You mean you don't like looking at his sexay butt?

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by kericr on Apr 10, 2009 9:37 AM EDT up reply actions

Maybe it's in that beard he's trying to grow.

by Erik Hahmann on Apr 10, 2009 9:31 AM EDT up reply actions

Check out my blog on web development at kericr.wordpress.com

by kericr on Apr 10, 2009 9:34 AM EDT up reply actions

I'm 95 percent going to PAX btw

by Erik Hahmann on Apr 10, 2009 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions

Aah, so that's why you asked me earlier.

I’m supposed to be flying to Miami some time next week to be presented with a job offer which unless is outright insulting, I’ll likely accept. From there it’s going to depend on if/when I need to move to the area and some other things I need to plan and figure out, so I really don’t know.

Check out my blog on web development at kericr.wordpress.com

by kericr on Apr 10, 2009 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions

Nice. I think we're going to go over Labor Day weekend.

by Erik Hahmann on Apr 10, 2009 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions

What is the innate advantage to the release point being lower?

Or is just that the difference between two pitchers is jarring?

by plasticman on Apr 10, 2009 9:17 AM EDT reply actions

It causes issues for batters picking the ball up.

The fact that the ball is released from a vastly different view than usual makes it very hard to pick up. Rather than looking practically straight on at the pitcher’s release point, the batter has to follow the ball in more. It’s just a funky thing that messes with hitters minds, and it’s one reason all these side-armers are relievers (because they live off deception).

by rglass44 on Apr 10, 2009 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions

The difference.

I’m not sure there is an advantage.

by R.J. Anderson on Apr 10, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions

When it's that low, sure there is

Two big differences:

1) As rglass mentioned, a lot of hitters have trouble picking up the ball out of an odd armslot, at least in the first couple pitches. Tony Gwynn and Wade Boggs are both on the record saying the pitchers they had the most trouble against were submariners and sidearmers. Part of the difference is offset by lower velocity, but it still takes longer to pick up the ball than the difference in the amount of time it takes for the ball to arrive to the plate. If you look at the numbers at the end of the day, there’s probably not a huge difference between sidearmers and overhand pitchers, but a lot of that has to do with a lower median talent level for sidearmers (i.e., most of them became sidearmers only because they were unsuccessful at throwing overhand, or in some cases, because an injury prevented them from continuing to throw overhand).

2) Physically, sidearm is a more ‘natural motion’ than overhand, at least with respect to shoulder movement, and thus sidearmers and submariners are thought to be less likely to get shoulder injuries (not that there’s a big enough sample to prove it).

Vogt early, Vogt often.

by Brickhaus on Apr 10, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions

That said

if there were equal numbers of sidearmers versus overhand pitchers, the overhand pitchers would have the advantage. The reason it works out well for sidearmers is because the hitters just aren’t used to the location they need to look at to pick up the ball.

Vogt early, Vogt often.

by Brickhaus on Apr 10, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions