Joe Maddon's Lineup Card Fiasco and Pat Burrell to the Disabled List
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 5:54 PM EDT
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PrintIf nothing else, more eyes will be examining the lineup card from now on. Joe Maddon is going to be mocked for this and Andy Sonnanstine is going to be praised for his RBI double. It didn't kill us today, but holy hell Joe, be more careful. Sonnanstine's hitting WPA was actually in the positive, not so much for his pitching WPA. Eventually he's going to have to pitch better consistently, the strike zone did him a few disfavors today, but that can be said in just about every start it seems. I'll look at Sonnanstine's pitchfx data more later on, but right now he's not throwing a pitch that breaks in to righties, everything breaks towards lefties. Is that a reason for the struggles? Not sure. Here's the zone plot:
The more pressing news is Burrell to the DL and Isringhausen up. That leaves the Rays bench as: Zobrist, Kapler, and Hernandez most days. Not ideal. It also gives the Rays 13 pitchers. Frankly that seems like waste, even with the recent usage patterns. I'm more interested in how this works once Burrell comes off the disabled list, does someone else go on, or is a pitcher moved in a trade?
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When you snack on danger....
You usually dine on death. Again, the Rays are a BETTER team then Cleveland, but this was an unnecessary handicap the Rays played with today. This gave Cleveland a chance today, and IF they had lost, Maddon would not have lived this down. In a way, he still can’t live it down; this is a direct reflection on his management, leadership and stewardship.
Screw Whitney Johnson for not asking harder questions in today’s post game. That is the problem with our media is that they are up so far up the keester they can’t see straight.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Maddon has three seasons as a manger to speak for those things.
One boneheaded mistake shouldn’t change anyone’s idea on him.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Maddon admitted so like a dozen times.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Maddon admitted he f-ed up, so what is there to hammer?
He wasnt even the one the messed up the lineup, but he took the heat.
Maddon said he fucked up. How could you be so heartless? You must hate the Rays and God.
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
You just said he wasn't the one who messed it up...
And again, I would like to know how the process is of how a lineup is formulated and presented. Does Maddon do it himself, or does he have a member of his staff write up the card? How does the media have a lineup before the game and it not match the card that is presented at home plate?
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Not referring to your comment
But to td32’s (Toby’s). Maddon DID mess up by not reviewing the oversight.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Have you ever heard of the phrase, "it is bad form to attack someone who is falling on their own sword?"
Maddon knew he screwed that up and he admitted it. There’s no reason to commence a bombardment where the Rays took 3 out or 4 and finally got over .500 at home. Let’s wait until he shits his pants in the dugout, or pinch-hits Michel Hernandez for Longoria before we start wielding this axe.
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
lineup miscue
Yes Joe can’t live it down. Since the last time this happen was in the 30’s. That is true.
But two things come to mind for me a Rays fan.
The only stat that I care about is in the win
loss category.
I guarantee you will not make this same mistake in his lifetime.
I guarantee it!!
xxyyxx
by aninsider on May 18, 2009 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions
If this was such a common thing...
More lineups would be submitted incorrectly. But Wedge does seem to have a problem with Maddon, so it must be a combination of both. I won’t forget this even though they won the game. This kind of oversight has NEVER happened to this degree.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
I agree with your supposition that Erik Wedge is a terrorist
Do what you love to do and give it your very best. Whether it's business or baseball, or the theater, or any field. If you don't love what you're doing and you can't give it your best, get out of it. Life is too short. You'll be an old man before you know it.
-Al Lopez
by Sandy Kazmir on May 18, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
It was a dick move by Wedge.
I find it difficult to believe this happens rarely. On any given day, I make between five and ten typos. Wrong date, misspelled word, etc. Everyone does. Sometimes you don’t catch them all. Do other people call you on it and demand you be punished for something easily fixable? No. If you do, you’re a dick. This wasn’t Wedge playing by the rules. Maddon wasn’t trying to pull one over on anyone.
And if you think this is something that MUST BE CAUGHT EVERY TIME, I look forward to the day FHP pulls you over for going 57 in a 55.
by ReasonableDoubt on May 18, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
"The only stat that I care about is in the win loss category."
Perhaps Buc’em is a little more your speed then, because with this mindset, I assure you that your stay here will be brief and uncomfortable.
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
by kericr on May 18, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
If you care more about results than processes, you aren't going to like it here.
by R.J. Anderson on May 18, 2009 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Way to be original
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
I replied before I saw your comment.
Notice the “rec” on yours?
by R.J. Anderson on May 18, 2009 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions
OIC what you did there
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
Whitney's postgame
He works for the Flagship radio station that air Rays games?? If
you want impartial criticism go to the national media. Their post
game show is only for Rays fans to celebrate a victory and boo hoo a loss.
My mama always said “Don’t bit the hand that feeds ya!!” let’s be real
xxyyxx
by aninsider on May 18, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Finally we have an insider here
The day has finally come as prophesied.
Do what you love to do and give it your very best. Whether it's business or baseball, or the theater, or any field. If you don't love what you're doing and you can't give it your best, get out of it. Life is too short. You'll be an old man before you know it.
-Al Lopez
by Sandy Kazmir on May 18, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Whitney...
Nice guy with a laissez-faire attitude. He is stuck in the 70’s with rock and roll. He isn’t a media type, just barely enough so people can like him. Too bad many want his job and he treats it like its time to go to the Ford Amphitheater for a cover band show…Sorry, he’s not real enough for me. Nice guy, but a phony and a fake when it comes to hardcore nuts and bolts.
Same goes for Rich Herrera with his awkward pauses and coughing (i.e. constant dump button usage).
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
It was a big boneheaded mistake
Maddon sometimes gets so bright that he outmanages himself. And it the situation in trying to rotate rest for everyone, someone, either Foley or Martinez or Henderson or whoever let him down.
As far as TOUGH goes, my problem is with Whitney. He is a big time problem on why our media sucks in this town. Nice guy, but again, look at the messenger.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Whitney Johnson is boss...
you just don’t know that
Leave me alone, I'm watching monsterjam.
by mrichardkent on May 17, 2009 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions
What questions did you want asked?
Please give examples.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Whitney
Is the ring leader in the post game pressers. He was today for sure… I want to know the process of how his lineup card is formulated, who writes it up, is it proofed and signed? He doesn’t have to rat out who specifically wrote the card up specifically, but I would love to know the PROCESS.
Whitney Johnson doesn’t know jack about the game of baseball. He is a court jester. He is a minion.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
If Maddon said "It's Davey's fault." then people would call Maddon spineless, etc.
He took blame. There’s no need to throw people under the bus.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Him saying that isn't necessary
Break down the detail of how he develops a lineup card. When does he sign it? Is it written for him? Etc…etc…
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Why is this important?
This is almost the 500th time he’s done this with the Rays and he’s made one mistake. The process apparently isn’t broken.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Its Marc Topkin's fault
It’s all on him…Why not ask for a review on how it happened? Obviously, his wishes weren’t conveyed properly.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Why not..
He thinks bloggers are his enemies, so blame him for it. He is a fill in the blank douchebag.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
I'm sure Topkin would like to take credit for the double
Leave me alone, I'm watching monsterjam.
by mrichardkent on May 17, 2009 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions
apparently not.
Leave me alone, I'm watching monsterjam.
by mrichardkent on May 17, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Not what I am saying...
It’s not a matter of WHO, but HOW!! HOW it could happen? Again, specifics!! Not that it did happen, but HOW it could happen!
Don’t get Steve involved in this, nothing to do with him. Its Planet Topkin’s fault and all of his minions he has his pulse on inside that clubhouse.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Maddon said he meant to put Evan at DH.
I am guessing he wrote the same thing next to Evan’s name that he’ll write 150 times…
Exactly, like when 2009 hit, people still wrote 2008 on their papers for a while by mistake.
by walkoffwalk on May 17, 2009 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
rec'd
I do this all the time at the beginning of every spring semester
by nolesblogger on May 18, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I can't tell if your issue is with Maddon or just the media.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions
either way it's entirely irrelevant
Leave me alone, I'm watching monsterjam.
by mrichardkent on May 17, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions
If Maddon was forced to be more accessible
i.e. more media availability and a willingness to agree to the so-called “manager’s show” which I have yet to hear, then maybe, I wouldn’t be so critical here. He is contractually obliged to have a 30 minute 1 day a week manager’s show as per the new radio broadcasting agreement
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
A show like that would be a waste most of the time anyway.
Callers get screened before hand and most of them that get threw have pretty basic questions. Tough, in-depth questions aren’t usually asked on those types of shows.
by nolesblogger on May 18, 2009 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Some Maddon but mostly the media
We got the crappiest “big time” media in the U.S. We deserve more probing insight that’s all. Not some “Greatful Dead” honk asking questions thinking that its Pink Floyd or Led Zeppelin time.
I know what Maddon meant, but again HOW it didn’t come to be is what I am trying to get at.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
"Not some "Greatful Dead" honk asking questions thinking that its Pink Floyd or Led Zeppelin time."
Well, that lost me.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions
That is Whitney Johnson
Tremendous baseball mind that is him
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
It's better than constant negativity
I don’t particularly like the local media but I prefer their brand of reporting much more than the Jay Mariotti, Platschke (sp?) type from Chicago and LA. I hate journalists that think it’s their job to pick apart every single move a team makes.
No, not really
But Whitney is NEVER serious…NEVER!! And that irreverence is my problem…He seems so out of it, like he’s drugged up and being prompted all the damn time.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Again no
But he is NEVER serious…NEVER (again). Can you be critical and still be popular? He is like the overgrown kid who can’t get enough lollipops. Too bad if the team dislikes him for being probing a time or two??
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
he wants to know how the f' up came about... that's all
not important at all but.. that’s all he wants to know
Leave me alone, I'm watching monsterjam.
by mrichardkent on May 17, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Thank you!!!!!
How and not why….How and not why.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
Your answer: Computer Glitch and a fail to double-check
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
Funny:)
Good one:) I just wonder why it hasn’t happened more often
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
I'm not joking. That's what happened. SP Times reported that this morning.
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
*err that's how it happened
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
COMPUTERS AND BASEBALL DON'T MIX MR. MADDON.
by R.J. Anderson on May 18, 2009 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
*madden
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
I can't wait until EA gets exclusive rights on baseball games so that I can play Maddon 2011, thus confusing the living bejezzus out of people
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
EVEN A GODDAMN COMPUTER SEES THAT YOU DO NOT BENCH EVAN LONGORIA
WAKE THE FUCK UP MADDEN IF A BOX CAN SEE IT WHY CAN YOU NOT. THE TIME IS NOW MADDEN.
Do what you love to do and give it your very best. Whether it's business or baseball, or the theater, or any field. If you don't love what you're doing and you can't give it your best, get out of it. Life is too short. You'll be an old man before you know it.
-Al Lopez
by Sandy Kazmir on May 18, 2009 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Whitney Johnson isn't a guy I'd consider media in Tampa
He’s the positive sports update guy. He puts a positive spin on things because that’s his role.
But he is...
On FSN Florida, I clearly heard him ask at least 3 questions, and maybe Rock Riley got in there on one too…But Whitney is the choir that you hear mostly at games.
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
On the face of it
It turned out to be a harmless mistake. The comment list would be twice as long had they lost. Old man Gammons and the rest of them said they’d never heard of that happening before. Really inexcusible.
This isn't the Nuremburg Trials
Let it go man, we won the game. If you want to be a one man wrecking crew nobody wants to hear it.
Do what you love to do and give it your very best. Whether it's business or baseball, or the theater, or any field. If you don't love what you're doing and you can't give it your best, get out of it. Life is too short. You'll be an old man before you know it.
-Al Lopez
by Sandy Kazmir on May 18, 2009 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions
He tried being cute
In giving his guys rest….His lack of oversight is what bothered me
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
I don't entirely enjoy the idea of Zobrist at 3B.
But how is that being cute?
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Giving him AB's
Just to get him on the field….Eventually, there is going to be a problem there. Zobrist will make a huge defensive mistake at some point and it will cost the team a game
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
One defensive mistake is not going to cost the team a game.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions
no.. he said HUGE defensive mistake..
Leave me alone, I'm watching monsterjam.
by mrichardkent on May 17, 2009 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions
And Zobrist is hitting well. I don't know if he's this good true talent wise, but whatever.
We’re missing Burrell, so he tried getting Longoria some rest time while keeping his bat around. That’s not unthinkable.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions
He doesn't need to be on the field to get ABs...
I don’t understand that connection…
Maddon likes to rest players from time to time… I can see why people don’t like that. What I don’t see is how that has anything to do with what happened today. The two have nothing to do with each other.
I really don’t understand the beating some people are giving Maddon here. He made a stupid error, it happens. At most it would have cost the Rays 3 ABs.
I still think we can open up a roster spot with Joyce
Joyce and Zobrist can essentially handle what Gross, Kapler, and Zobrist currently handle.
www.raysprospects.com
Kapler's the odd man out there.
Gross has far more value than him.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions
RJ
Is the reason you left Aybar off the bench list above because he is the new DH?
If so, can we get some comparisons of the two? That would be interesting.
Comparisons of Aybar/Burrell?
And yeah, I figured he’d get most of the DH reps, although who knows the way things went today.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions
My favorite part of the fight was Burrell running out late because he wasn't wearing a uniform
and had to go to the clubhouse and get one. It was only half on as he got onto the field.
Tools Whore
Why did he have to put a jersey on in the first place?
Is there a rule about coming on the field without a jersey? Or was he just sitting in the dugout shirtless (this would be awesome)?
by nolesblogger on May 18, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
You'll get fined it you're in the dugout without a jersey.
Happened to Tito several times during the early and late season. He would wear a jacket and never take it off, but not wear a uniform shirt. MLB started sending people to check and make sure that he’s not in uniform.
So yeah, it’s a rule. He had his teammates back, but not without protecting his wallet.
Tools Whore
The reason for the lineup card mistake:
No Tampa Bay Rays lineup card will ever be complete without Evan Longoria batting 3rd at 3rd base. Learn it, Maddon! Don’t try that crap again.
Visit the Rays Revolutionary Blog at http://raysrev.blogspot.com
Dunno.
I think Maddon likes having Zobrist available to move around if needed.
by R.J. Anderson on May 17, 2009 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I love it!!
Mission accomplished!!
Put Tampa Bay back on our road uniforms!!
That time is now
Do what you love to do and give it your very best. Whether it's business or baseball, or the theater, or any field. If you don't love what you're doing and you can't give it your best, get out of it. Life is too short. You'll be an old man before you know it.
-Al Lopez
by Sandy Kazmir on May 18, 2009 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions
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