Let's talk Stadium.
by EminenceFront on Jun 16, 2009 8:37 PM EDT
118 comments
With the recent news that a Trop renovation wouldn't be reasonable, it's time that we take a look at some of the details in this plan. In this segment, I'm going to try to find out what this region will and can support. Let's get started.
I'm going to limit this discussion to only about 4 of the sites floating around as possible construction areas and a 5th that may be somewhat interesting. These five include: St. Pete/Clearwater Airport (A), Toytown Dump (B), the current location (C), Derby Lanes (D), UT Adjacent (F), and the mystery location: the recently closed TECO Power Plant in Oldsmar.
BAY AREA POPULATION DENSITY:
St. Pete/Clearwater International Airport (Airport Code PIE):
INFRASTRUCTURE: Although central to the Tampa/St. Pete area, PIE is almost bereft of Interstate Traffic. Yes the Bayside Bridge and Roosevelt/Ulmerton do support some local traffic but not nearly enough to support the +/- 35,000 attendance the Rays plan on building for. GRADE: C
AVAILABILITY: As recently as about 6 months ago, PIE has lost several small but important airlines such as USA 3000 are leaving quickly. Even with these departures, PIE is controlled by the County and is very unlikely to be made available in the near future. GRADE: D
POPULATION: According to the 2000 US Census, PIE is right in the middle of the area in Pinellas County where population density is the lowest. Commercial population is relatively decent but it's not nearly as great as Tampa or St. Pete. GRADE: C
REGIONABILITY: PIE is decent at best for Pinellas and Hillsborough (terrible for Pasco). It's is awful for Orlando and the Sarasota/Bradenton market. Again, the Gandy bridge is the only viable interstate option for either side. GRADE: F
POSSIBILITY GRADE: D This option is possibly the worst avaiable regionally speaking.
Toytown Dump:
INFRASTRUCTURE: This beautiful former dump is I-275 adjacent and is located in a central location in regards to Tampa and St. Pete. Parking is non-existent but that's for another post. The only drawback is that the I-275 area becomes bogged down fast. Really fast. Gamedays as they are now can strain the system. GRADE: B
AVAILABILITY: Being a former dump (ceased being used in the 70's/80's), the status of the soil underneath is in question. It will most certainly be an issue in regards to this site. Having said that, it is the biggest unused parcel left in Pinellas County and it is left to be seen if the County will hand it over for a ballpark. GRADE: C
POPULATION: Somewhat in the middle of mid-southern Pinellas County, Toytown is decent for residential but above-average for commercial. GRADE: C+
REGIONABILITY: It's somewhat available to the higher populated areas in Hillsborough and Sarasota/Bradenton. Orlando is not going to be a significant draw and the ever-growing Pasco County is a bit out of a reach. GRADE: C
POSSIBILITY GRADE: B This option may be the County's only choice if nobody else wants to accept it.
Current Location of Tropicana Field: Everyone knows this already...POSSIBILITY: F The team already said so...
Derby Lane:
INFRASTRUCTURE: Off-ramps would have to be built but the location is again, I-275 adjacent. Local traffic is limited to Roosevelt and similar roads and that isn't much.GRADE: C+
AVAILABILITY: Derby Lane is still open for business. It would either have to close or the owner would have to sell in order for this option to become available. GRADE: D
POPULATION: Serves the Tampa area better than Pinellas. Better for Sarasota/Bradenton than others. Worse for Pasco. The area does not have tons of residential. In fact, it's in the lower third. Commercial is decent (about the same as Toytown with the added benefit of a bridge right to Downtown Tampa at it's doorstep). GRADE: D
REGIONABILITY: Average for Tampa, Meh for Pinellas, Decent for Sarasota/Manatee, Bad for Pasco, and average for Orlando (however miniscule it may be). GRADE: C
POSSIBILITY GRADE: B- Out of all the options, this one may end up being the best fit...according to this part of our studies.
UT ADJACENT: It's been done before here. I'll try to find the link sometime soon. POSSIBILITY GRADE: F Pinellas/St. Pete will not let the team move to Tampa.
Former TECO Power Plant:
I'm throwing this out there because it raises an outside-the-box answer to a very hard problem. For this one, I'm leaving the 5 points of all my previous arguments up to you...
I know what I tihnk, I want to heard it from everyone else.
I look forward to continuing on to Part II if everyone is interested in a step-by-step approach covering all bases the best we can.
REGIONAL POPULATION DENSITY: (The green dot is approx. the center of all areas)
5 recs |
118 comments
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Not trying to answer anything...
Just trying to organize some facts to layout an argument of any kind.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 16, 2009 8:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Tampa Bay Downs?
Do you mean Derby Lane?
by tallyray on Jun 16, 2009 8:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes. Fixed.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 16, 2009 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's fixed in the "edit" section.
Just not being pushed to the site. Odd.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Make a mini island right off of Channelside
by matthan on Jun 16, 2009 11:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Screw that
Underwater baseball.
I could be wrong though
by staplemaniac on Jun 17, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That would be soo sweet
For what they paid to build the new Yankee Stadium we could probably make this happen.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 17, 2009 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
Underwater baseball= More sellout stadium fans, haha.
We need Robots....The time is now Bud, Stern, and Goodell.
Seriously, Officiating Sucks in this Country
by Some other guy who does not care on Jun 20, 2009 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
B plz
I could ride my bike to the stadium.
by steve-o1285 on Jun 17, 2009 9:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
How could the green dot possibly be the pop center of the area?
unless you are including orlando, which would be dumb IMO
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 9:51 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
A, B, and D look closest to the population center to me
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
expanding on that
I think the area that gets screwed is North Pinellas. The Trop is much more difficult to get to for them then it is for people in south/central Hillsborough.
I work in Carrolwood and it takes me 35 minutes to get to the Trop on a weeknight. It would take longer then that if I lived in Palm Harbor or Clearwater
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm in Oldsmar (hence the Power Plant bit)
It does take a very long time to reach St. Pete on Gamedays. I think it makes sense to put it somewhere reachable to St. Pete and Tampa as well as Pasco and Sarasota Manatee. North Pinellas may make some kind of sense for that.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The lack of interstate infrastructure in North Pinellas makes it unfeasible
IMO.
I lived near St. Pete airport, and during rush hour, it would take an hour to get to Countryside, much less Oldsmar. Without new highways, North Pinellas isn’t convenient for anyone who isn’t in North Pinellas, Pasco, or Northwest Hillsborough.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
But interstate infrastructure would have to be modified anywhere the Rays intend to build. It’s an interesting option however unfeasible.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Modification is one thing
But building whole new highways is another. Modification is doable.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also Agree
Some definite infrastrucure work would have to be done
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am talking the Gateway area
not Oldsmar, north Pinellas BTW.
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right.
All options seem to point to the Derby Lane’s area.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was about to mention the same thing.
How much of a bump in attendance could we expect if they cut the drive time from 2 hrs to 1.5 hrs from Orlando to the stadium?
by steve-o1285 on Jun 17, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You'd get a bigger bump from Polk County
Than you would from Orange.
M.V.Z. Most Valuable Zorilla!
by SeanDubbs on Jun 17, 2009 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would say more people would go
The problem is, is that if you get out of work at 5 you have Orlando traffic, then I-4 through Polk county is a breeze, but then you get to Tampa around 6:45 and get stuck at the bridge, if not, right as you’re getting into the city. It would take 2.5 hours to go Orlando to St. Pete. So by the time you park and get inside it is almost 8 and you’ve missed a third of the game. That half hour could make a big difference, especially if they started more games at 7:30.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 17, 2009 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's why the Rays won't leave Pinellas.
The draw from Orlando isn’t as significant as the draw from Sarasota/Manatee. People use the excuse that “People drive from Orlando for the Bucs!” Yeah but that’s only once a week and 8 times a season.
IMO Orlando isn’t really in the plans to draw for attendance. Orlando is probably best suited for TV/Radio and other marketing purposes.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Plus Bucs games are on Sunday Afternoon
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The draw from Orlando isn't significant?
I’m just not understanding the thought process here.
Consider the facts.
If the stadium is built in Tampa (where it should be) it takes no more than an hour to get to Tampa from the farrest Eastern portion of Orange Co. It would extend the ride of Sarasota resident to around 45 min. right down I -75 and cut the ride to Pasco/Hernando residents in half.
Why is this significant?
Orange Co. pop. 1.1M
Pasco .5M
Hernando .25M
Sar/Brad .45M
Tampa is the centralized location which would undoubtedly draw a hell of alot more in fanbase just looking at the population figures and drive time. Who the heck cares about making Sarasota & Bradenton residents drive and extra 25 min or so? They make up next to nothing as far as fanbase.
Then you have to consider the major corporations, youth, more money, etc. The list goes on forever to “why” a new stadium has to be built in Tampa.
It’s just smart business.
by ConnorManning on Jun 19, 2009 8:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it takes no more than an hour to get to Tampa from the farrest Eastern portion of Orange Co
This is pretty far fetched, I’m a fast driver, one time I made it from the Trop to my driveway in East Orlando in 83 mins at 3 AM, but there is no way in hell that you can say the drive should only take an hour. I know it makes your case look stronger, and I like your case, because I completely agree with it, but you shouldn’t twist the facts on this point. MAP It takes at least 90 mins to get to Tampa and with traffic is is more like a consistent 2 hours.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 19, 2009 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Orlando is a horrible ride.
Rush hour in Orlando is something I avoid at all costs. While I may have been overzealous in my 1 hr guesstimation, your map is a wee bit off as well. The point being if a stadium is in Tampa it will attract more of the Orange Co. population.
by ConnorManning on Jun 19, 2009 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How is my map off
It goes from UCF (eastern Orange County) to Tampa, FL, add in another 30 minutes to get to the Trop and I would gladly like to see the stadium in Tampa. Of course I no longer live in Florida so who cares.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 19, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I haven't decided where in Tampa the stadium should be!
Why the heck don’t you live in the hot, humid, Florida?
by ConnorManning on Jun 19, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's 2 reasons
I grew up in upstate New York and moved to Orlando for college, after school I got a decent job, but after telling them how much I missed my family and that they were the only reason I was staying they let me move back up north and work from home. Talk about a win-win.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 19, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The margin of error for his map, if any, is significantly less then the margin of error for your 1 hour estimate.
You’re not making it from Orlando to Tampa between the hours of 5-7 in any less then 1 hour and 30 minutes unless it’s a weekend. The traffic is ALWAYS too heavy, speed is too strictly enforced, and no combination of roads to get to US92 and take it until it transitions to State Rd. 574 will get you there any faster. This argument is worthless unless you can prove it. Otherwise, your speculating.
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
by kericr on Jun 19, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
More, sure, but 300 more a game would be a very optimistic estimation.
In other words, it’s a factor, but it’s so far down the totem pole that there are about 100 other factors to consider ahead of it.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 22, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly.
It’s not important enough to be a major deciding factor.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 22, 2009 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Far-fetched my ass, the only way you're getting there in an hour or less is if you fly.
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
by kericr on Jun 19, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I actually like the stadium on I4 right by the casino
by matthan on Jun 19, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
SPORTS BETTING
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
by kericr on Jun 19, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I think the Lakeland side of Tampa accomodates everyone quite well, and
from the look of things land is pretty plentiful on that side. If you want something in the middle with the aim for the largest pool of people within a 90 minute drive that is where I would go. Additionally, I-4 and 275/75 already exist. The casino is a good point since I always see elderly people in there that obviously don’t mind the drive. All, but the beaches are best accommodated this way, and who cares about them anyway?
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 19, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
except all of Pinellas county
a weeknight drive all the way through Tampa….no thank you
The only feasible locations that keep most of the population close are in Pinellas close to the bridges or in Tampa close to the bridges.
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 19, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It would probably be easier
I lived in New Port Richey for 6 months and the drive to the Trop sucked ass, how could it be any worse to get on 75 and ride that all the way? How about they build it in your backyard then you don’t have to drive anywhere.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 19, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which is the point.
I am a season ticket holder. I go to aprrox. 20% of the home games due to the long drive as I am North of NPR. While I normally have no problem giving my tix away, I would love to be there every game. I get home from working around 6 O’clock and it takes approx 1:15 min if everything goes right and I’m rushing just to get into the stadium. A more realistic time to get to my seat is 1;30 min +. Being on the Pasco/Hernando boarder to get to Tampa taking the vets is around 35 min, add another 15 min depending on where the staadium is located taking a casual ride. This would cut the ride from 1:30 min to 45 min for residents in Pasco/Hernando alone who make up close to 3/4 million in population.
My issue is proximity. I believe that most people in Pinellas who are diehard fans would make the drive to Tampa. If they don’t it still opens up a market of close to 2 million more people that are in shooting range of a 7 PM game.
You’re most likely going to increase fanbase by close to 10,000 fans per game judging by location alone by not having another stadium built in Pinellas co.
by ConnorManning on Jun 20, 2009 8:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That side of Tampa is inaccessible to about 1.5 million people actually in the area
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 22, 2009 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How is it inaccessible?
Guards? Drug dogs? What makes it so that it is impossible for people to traverse to that locale?
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 23, 2009 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't the point to put the new stadium somewhere thats easy to get to
for most people.
Well that would not be the place. I
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 23, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry to inconvenience you
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 23, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The casino is only 45 minutes away from people in the western most portions of pinellas county
Granted during rush hour that amount of time will pick up. However on the other hand there has been quite a bit of construction that would be complete by the time the stadium is built. Ulmerton road would be pretty smooth getting to the bridge. Then i-275 going northbound would be quite a bit better. My guess is if you live around the St Pete Beach to Clearwater beach area it would take you about 50 mins to an hour to get to the stadium at the casino area…
That isn’t that bad folks. Of course we can say the same thing about the people in Tampa going to the Trop right now…
by matthan on Jun 25, 2009 9:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your time estimates are suspect
How long does someone who lives near the fairgrounds say it takes to get to the Trop on a weeknight? Considering the Trop is located right off the Interstate in eastern Pinellas county.
Your just going to have the same problem you have now with the opposite people.
If you have a chance to build a new stadium. Why would you not put it in a more centralized location?
The fairgrounds make as much sense as putting it back in central St. Pete
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 25, 2009 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I lived on Indian Rocks Beach for quite awhile and I gambled all the team
~45 mins from there to the Casino
Right now I live on 4th St in St Pete and it takes me 20 mins to get to the casino without traffic
These are very conservative. As in within the flow of traffic (maybe a bit slower).
If there is traffic obviously that would boost things up. But the construction on ulmerton has made things a lot smoother (like around US19/thewinghouse/etc. And once they are done with I275N it should be much more smooth sailing going up there.
The Howard Franklin/Kennedy area may still be an issue though
by matthan on Jun 25, 2009 9:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so your saying that people who live by the Casino
can get to the Trop in under 30 minutes. If so then why are people complaining about the location
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 25, 2009 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't say that
I never once mentioned anything under 30 mins. Heck I wasn’t even comparing the distance between the Trop and the Casino. However we don’t really have to cater to the people around the Trop. Those folks aren’t really showing up to the games.
by matthan on Jun 25, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you can get to the Casino in 45 from Indian Rocks
Then I’m not sure why thinking it would be 30 minutes from the trop would be far fetched. So if someone who lives all the way out in BFE seffner can get to the Trop in ~ 30 minutes then I can’t understand why people are complaining about the Trops location.
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 25, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats not even the point
I was just expressing how I don’t believe your estimates are correct. Not on a weeknight. Not with additional game traffic.
The point is that how can the same people that complain about a ~ 45 minute drive want to put the stadium in a place where a huge amount of the population is still ~ 45 minutes away. Why would those people expect them to make the drive reguarly when they don’t themselves?
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 25, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think downtown St Pete is the furthest drive on average for the most amount of people. It isn’t great for central and north Pinellas county, let alone Hillsborough/Pasco etc.
There are plenty of places to put it that would reduce overall drive time for the average fan.
However I agree with your premise. The drive time excuse is just total bs. Driving an hour or so shouldn’t be that big of a deal. People expect the stadium to be just as close as the local movie theater.
by matthan on Jun 26, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also I resent you assumption that the people around the Trop don't support the team
I don’t think anyone has a breakdown of where the people attending games live at.
Plus I think a much more reasonable assumption is that St. Pete is the only area that is supporting the Rays with any numbers on weeknights.
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 25, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So have they decided to build it in your back yard yet?
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 25, 2009 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In a discussion with the St. Petersburg Times editorial board, Lyash acknowledged Thursday that proximity to the maximum number of fans “has become more important” in weighing potential sites. The factor, he said, weighs against the two extremities being considered: downtown St. Petersburg and the fairgrounds.
Imagine that
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 25, 2009 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We have some really smart people here.
Also, I was unaware that the SPT a) had editors and b) was still in existence..
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 26, 2009 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's funny how the SPT runs this story about a week after mine...
And states exactly what has been determined here.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 26, 2009 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No chance an even remotely significant amount more of people make the drive from Orlando
to weeknight games in Tampa rather then in St. Pete.
BTW the bridge isn’t a problem at all on weeknights heading towards Pinellas. Especially not at almost 7 o’clock
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Everytime I went through there it was a pain in the ass
Maybe I’m not used to it so what seemed like a pain to me was just normal, but I remember sitting there for minutes at a time, when I was already under the gun to get to the Trop.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 17, 2009 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
actually on the bridge?
or before the bridge in Tampa
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I drive the Frankland home every day and there is never any stoppages on the bridge
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Before the bridge in Tampa
That’s what I never got, because once you got on the bridge it was smooth sailing and that road was just as wide as 275 joining.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 17, 2009 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's the line to get off onto 60
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This sums up my feelings
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 17, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Transportation in this area, on the whole, is horri-awful.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Northbound the HF is always very slow
Southbound it is pretty smooth.
by matthan on Jun 26, 2009 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The green dot is only a "suggestion" if we were to include Orlando as a major part of our plans.
It’s kind of an idea of where it would have to be to service TB primary, Sarasota/Orlando secondary.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you show a green dot, but just including the Tampa Bay area
Pasco, Pinellas, Hillsbourough, Polk, Manatee, Sarasota
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's approximate but favoring the Sarasota/Manatee area based on actual pull...
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
An inch north and I think you are on to something
2 main bridges intersecting at the Trop, surrounded by water. Could probably get a DHS grant since it would be pretty much terrorist free
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 17, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So thats right in the area that there looking at
I think this is the best spot. Good for Clearwater. Good for St. Pete. Good for Tampa
Most of the area should be within a 30 min drive
Free Ray Durham!
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's almost right at Derby Lane.
It makes the most regional sense.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
SPIA isn't a legitimate option
Even if every commercial airline leaves them, it’s still an important Coast Guard station, and UPS and FedEx use it a ton.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 1:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Exactly. It's not going to happen.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And while I know Selgy is a dirty word around here
The idea he’s pushed a few times which makes a ton of sense to me is the park north of University of Tampa, across the river from Downtown. Downtown is dead by gametime anyway, so there would be tons of available parking, and traffic would be flowing in the opposite direction from the jams.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 1:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Actually, re-reading I see it was mentioned
I don’t know about ‘not letting the team move to Tampa’ though. If they can’t get the public support in Pinellas, they won’t have a choice.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here's the link
http://raysbb.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9586
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, i've read this before and it seems reasonable
apparently i’m in the minority, but i would be surprised if the team didn’t end up in tampa.
by RaysTheRoof on Jun 17, 2009 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just don't think St. Pete will let them out of a lease. Especially with it being such a hot ticket around election time.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Having said that,
I really like the idea of it being in that park. It makes a lot of sense.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Eventually it will be a cost-benefit analysis
the cost of the getting out the lease will be offset by increased revenue in the new park. Of course, they would only make a move to Tampa once it is obvious that they won’t get a new ballpark in St. pete. Also, I have no idea how much of the bill Tampa/Hillsborough would be willing to pick up — this could be a sticking point.
by RaysTheRoof on Jun 17, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It will cost the team numbers from Sarasota/Manatee.
Which is a pretty significant amount. Now, will that be made up by Tampa numbers….idk.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What's the worst that happens if the team breaks the lease?
It would only cost like $50M to break the lease at this point.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 17, 2009 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
True.
The people in St. Pete may not be forgiving. I’m not thinking it’s going to be an issue but it would have to happen.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's not like they're moving to Portland
St. Peteians should not be such a bunch of whiny crybabies. They’ve had 12 years of baseball to enjoy.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 17, 2009 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am a St. Pete native and I agree
If we can’t provide a stadium for them then let them go to Tampa.
I just want the Rays to stay in the area no matter what.
Kap-rilla???
by Sveet on Jun 17, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wish you were the majority.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 18, 2009 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thank you Brick
See, im not that much of a nutjob (okay, yes i am)
Why I think the Rays will move to Tampa (page 1)
And page 6 (has info on the highspeed rails that will be built)
by selgy on Jun 20, 2009 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
page 6 has the highspeed rail info (sorry, didnt know how to edit)
by selgy on Jun 20, 2009 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How's that
passionate sex with your hand treating you?
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 20, 2009 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
?
What exactly are you trying to get at?
And what does that have to do with this thread?
by selgy on Jun 20, 2009 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What do high speed rails have to do with reality
This has been proposed for over a decade and is still myth more than fact.
Rays Win!
by Sandy Kazmir on Jun 21, 2009 2:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
read...
Read the articles/links i attached to that page and you will see that funding for these projects are closer to reality than at any point.
And again…What exactly were you trying to get at with your “passionate sex” line? I’m guessing it was just to antagonize me and if that is the case, I am sorry for you.
by selgy on Jun 21, 2009 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can clarify that for you:
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
by kericr on Jun 21, 2009 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Am I?
Really? Is that because I have a different opinion than others on this site? So that suddenly makes me a “dick”.
That’s fine I guess. I would rather be called a dick than be some of the posters on this site who determined i was a dick cause I HAD A DIFFERENT OPINION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh yeah, I forgot, I am a dick cause I wished everyone a safe new years. Yeah, how dare I wish everyone a safe new years. How dick of me.
I am also a dick cause I happened to make a stadium proposal a few months ago and it happens that others brought it up in this post.
So yes, maybe my post to RJ a few weeks ago was a little childish, but does that mean I am a dick? No. Just as you calling me a dick doesnt make you a dick. This is the interent and I dont know who you are from a few words that you type.
K, so back to the topic at hand. I was mentioned in this thread due to my stadium proposal, so if you want to talk about the stadium, then lets talk. If not, then please let this die.
by selgy on Jun 22, 2009 1:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I want to talk about the stadium. Hell, I wouldn't even mind talking about your opinion. Just not with you.
"Where we all wait in earnest with pudding in hand for the Upton comet to sail through the roofed skies, so that we may meet Him."
by kericr on Jun 22, 2009 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What's worse is if I wrote that I'd be banned from here yet again!
Maybe Ker can do us all a favor and ban himself!
WooHoo!
by ConnorManning on Jun 22, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Aah but see, there's a difference.
I didn’t like what he did, it was borderline trolling, but not a personal attack, therefore, no grounds to ban.
Saying I should ban myself on the other hand, well…there’s only one answer to that.
I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.
by kericr on Jun 22, 2009 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And you're right, calling you a dick was out of line. Your post though is clearly dickish in nature.
I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.
by kericr on Jun 22, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
One thing to consider is relative wealth of the areas, too.
by rglass44 on Jun 17, 2009 3:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
This was merely a look at population.
I’m planning a post on wealth and attendance sometime soon.
Sign lady must die.
by EminenceFront on Jun 17, 2009 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cool.
I did one last year sometime regardin St. Pete versus Tampa looking at essentially money per mile and population density. Let me look for a link.
by rglass44 on Jun 17, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kinda like how you hallucinate having a girlfriend?
Swav or Die
For the lulz
by SRQman on Jun 17, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nah, bitch is just playing hard to get lately.
Guess he shouldn’t have inflated her with helium.
by Suttree on Jun 17, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't see portland or vegas on that list.
by putupyourDUKES on Jun 19, 2009 10:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Because they're not legitimate options.
Heck, El Paso or Omaha or Rochester would be more feasible in real life than Portland or Vegas. Portland doesn’t have close to enough population or major business infrastructure to support a second major pro franchise, and with Vegas there’s that whole sportsbook issue and Bud’s prior history with the gambling establishment.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
by Brickhaus on Jun 22, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You cannot build a stadium that far from the freeways
The Higgins Steam Power Plant site, the one in Oldsmar you’re referring to, just will not work.
I would go for Derby Lane one, Toytown two, UT three
We know something you don't know
And if we don't share then we don't grow
Unabomber set the whole world on fire
by Orlando Rays on Jun 22, 2009 4:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Anything on I-275 beyond the Veterans will bog down because of the Veterans interchange
And I don’t see it changing with the current construction project, because I-275 itself will remain four lanes through the interchange.
We know something you don't know
And if we don't share then we don't grow
Unabomber set the whole world on fire
by Orlando Rays on Jun 22, 2009 4:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Hey I have a great idea everyone...read on
Let’s not build a new stadium and say we did.
by acablue on Jun 23, 2009 12:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Let's build a park on the Al Lang site...
…with homers that splash into McGriff Bay!
by fogelberg on Jun 23, 2009 4:56 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
See: PoWW
We know something you don't know
And if we don't share then we don't grow
Unabomber set the whole world on fire
by Orlando Rays on Jun 24, 2009 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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