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Around SBN: The Gift Of The 2003 Tigers

7/28 Post-Game: New York Yankees @ Tampa Bay Rays

Newest_tiny by R.J. Anderson on

290728130_yankees_rays_136120960_lbig_medium

via www.fangraphs.com

I don't know if tonight was the last for Scott Kazmir as a Ray, but if it comes to such, thanks for the memories and for tonight, Scott.

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Read More: Scott Kazmir (P - ANA), Tampa Bay Rays, New York Yankees

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Scotty K will be missed if he goes

OT: A’s have tying run at the plate vs. BOS

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:05 PM EDT reply actions  

Just finished combing through gameday

It looks like he looked pretty good. Considering the slow Trop gun, he was humping it up there at 93MPH for the first couple innings and was doing a good job with location. I’d still like to see more strikeouts. I really don’t know what to think of him anymore, he’s very Jeckyl/Hyde right now.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:06 PM EDT reply actions  

Rather than clog the post game wrap up with an Ambien laced argument w/ Kericr

I’ll just say – Great game, glad I went to it, and GO RAYS tomorrow. Let’s take this series!

Wow, Kaz really suprised me tonight

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:07 PM EDT reply actions  

I think thats his mom

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 28, 2009 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

REC'D

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

lol

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sign lady is jealous of his tv time.

"Typical negro, laying down on the job." -R.J. Anderson

by steve-o1285 on Jul 28, 2009 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nah

That’s him from earlier in life

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kaz has been a much better pitcher since coming back.

If we can move him in a good deal, sure. I still think he has better days ahead. NO urgency to move.

Follow Me on Twitter @FreeZorilla

by FreeZorilla on Jul 28, 2009 10:09 PM EDT reply actions  

if he doesn't get moved than in the pen is better than in AAA

but I feel like Sonny will bring more in return than a pen arm and the difference in value between Sonny/pen arm in actual production from the pen isn’t going to be as much.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is there a market for Wheeler?

What about Wheeler and a couple of C/C+ level pitching prospects for a B/B+ position player? Is there a team out there that would make this trade? Should we?

I saw where Victor Wang puts the value of a C pitching prospects @ $2.1M and a B level position prospect @ $5.5M. Would Wheeler be enough to make up the difference in this type of scenario?

Heres where I found the prospect rankings. http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2009/3/3/777412/al-west-farm-system-values

by ReyL on Jul 29, 2009 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

we are one injury away from this not being a smart comment

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Indeed. That's a dumb thing to say.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

stop agreeing with me! I don't like you, remember?

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't believe many will shed a tear if Davis has to be called up before Sep 1.

I don’t see a huge difference in Davis/Sonny production at this point.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

sonny at least has some track record of success

SHIT, now I’m agreeing w/ you. this is getting weird. i’m going to bed

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I never disagreed with your point yesterday, only the way you presented it.

And saying that your statement or opinion is idiotic or stupid is not the same as calling you such.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

it's all good. after waking up and reviewing the way I typed my "argument" -

i’m thinking about getting off the Ambien all together. That was a fairly disjointed discussion.

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

no shit.

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

it made a lot more sense in my head than it did in print

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

well that gives you an unfair advantage in late night arguments

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Performance enhancers.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is booze a medication?

I can't help that I make some things look easier than they really are.

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 28, 2009 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not in my world it isn't.

I only drink on the weekends though.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can't be exactly sure

do I think he will be as good as Tommy Hanson right away, no , will he go 3 innings and give up 10 runs each time, no. But there is a reason so many people are really high on him and I would assume that he will be good.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

HELLO

Sonny has 500+ innings of major league experience with a 4.2 fip as a starter

I’m sorry, but I trust that more than Davis at this point in time

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Plus Sonny isn't at all expensive.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

and next year stay with Sonny

and keep Davis in AAA forever because he doesn’t have MLB experience.

and all this is IF someone gets hurt. I’m just saying that I think trading Sonny brings more value than keeping him in AAA or turning him into a reliever. I’m not saying Davis>Sonny right now. I’m saying he might be and at worst isn’t going to be that much worse than Sonny.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

You can trade Kaz, or you can trade Sonny in the offseason. I guess if he goes as part of a trade to bring back Lee/V-Mart/Halladay or what have you, that's fine, but to bring in someone like Zaun with him is dumb.

Ignore the fact that Sonny for Zaun is a rediculously unfair trade and imagine that Zaun would be part of a package for Sonny. Still a dumb trade.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

If you trade Sonny in the off-season as a reliever

does he still bring back the same package he does right now as a perfectly capable starter? I could be wrong but I think not.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

or does Niemann bring back more right now and then we get an upgrade from Niemann to Sonny

its a win-win, unless you think Niemann will improve, as I do, in which case you find spots for them in the rotation (or choose the better one, who I still believe is Sonny) at least until their value gets to a point (Niemann would always probably have mroe value) that you can trade them for maximum return

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would rather keep Niemann as well but I would be fine with trading him too.

I think we have 7 MLB capable arms right now (Talbot hurt, so not included) and one of these guys needs to be moved to bring back maximum value. We found out this past off season with Hammel what happens with waiting, I fear if we wait until the off-season we won’t get nearly as much for any of the guys, especially Sonny if he has been pitching out of the pen for 2 months

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sonny is not the key to anybody's playoff run.

As a new pitcher at the beginning of the year, he holds a lot more value.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sonny is better than Niemann

or trade Davis… thats what you do with pitching depth if you have it

you don’t just give up a proven #3 – #4 type starter in the majors who is young, cost controlled, and even when he hits arbitration shouldn’t get as much as he is truly worth

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sonny still doesn't K anyone

his K/9 is lower at AAA than Rays

Less HR, less BB, but could it be MLB hitters>AAA?

by Raymondo on Jul 28, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

look, after tonight he might have a sub 2 fip in AAA

if you are seriously criticizing it I should just stop arguing.

Niemann doesn’t get more swinging Ks than Sonny anyway, but everyone seems to love him…

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

I for one didn't think Price was ready

Davis has spent over a year in AAA and has been successful there.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm a fan of Talbot but he is a casualty

If you have a guy as talented as Davis you don’t let him rot in AAA forever. I’m not saying kick someone out of the rotation for him but at this point I think if someone were to get hurt he has earned a right to get a shot in the majors. Talbot had his chance and wasn’t exactly lights out.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh come on now.

Talbot has like three appearances in the majors and has pitched far better than anyone in that rotation the last two years. Niemann included.

by R.J. Anderson on Jul 28, 2009 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I could be getting guys confused

so I’m probably wrong on this one. Like I said I like Talbot I think he will be good but I don’t think his upside is that of any of the other 3.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't forget Hell Boy

if his first start was any indication he could be ready by September.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

I still think those 5 get a shot before him

Hellboy had his group of friends to advance up through the levels with, but now he is kinda in limbo with Heath Rollins slowly trailing behind.

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

yea I was joking on that one

but next year at this time we may be having the same arguement. What happens if Hellickson is just dominating AAA but we have Garza, Price, Shields, Niemann, Davis (or whoever survives) it is a really nice “problem” to have.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

And it's one we are going to have for a while

After Hellickson there’s still the recovery of Jacob Mcgee, plus Heath Rollins, Alex Cobb, and Matt Moore climbing the minor league ladder.

by behn on Jul 28, 2009 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

not to mention Barnese

and the slew of low level starter/relievers who are semi-prospects we have. One of them will probably turn out to get up pretty high, at least I’d assume

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

you know, I usually keep this opinion quiet, but I would look around to see what we could get for Garza

I would never actually make a big deal about that claim because I’ll look like a looney, but I really don’t think he is worth 8-12 million in arb when compared to our plethora of options for much much cheaper. Keep focusing on the offense, I don’t like using money on pitchers, especially when we have an excess

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

it all depends on if he can bring it all together

he has the stuff to be an ace but hasn’t gotten it all together in the head yet. But if someone wants to sweep us off our feet I would listen.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree that I think he will be an ace

its more on how much will he get in arb (6-8 mil is more reasonable than 10-12 mil+). I actually think he will stabalize around borderline ace territory, which makes me sad to say I wouldn’t mind trading him, but if we could get a Michael Taylor + Jason Donald + Carlos Carrasco type of deal (obvious allusion) I would look hard

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn't know prospects suck

you wouldn’t really know, would you

AND A 4.25 FIP DOES NOT SUCK, MATT GARZA’S IS 4.17

Matt Garza > Sonny, but not 10 million+ better.

Jesus fuck

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's not looney

He carries the most perceived value and could still bring a ton of value back with 3 years of arb left to go.

I can't help that I make some things look easier than they really are.

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 28, 2009 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

its just that though, I feel a team with a high payroll would go after him

which means I could see the Yankees and RedSox. I could also see the Angels inquiring, but I don’t think we get back enough from them.

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

for some reason I feel they would just be too wraped up in money issues

and they have guys like James McDonald and Scott Elbert who could probably start now and be effective, thats why I shied away from him

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

How does that work as far as the 40/60/80 scale?

I like Garza a lot but, to me, he carries the largest return.

I can't help that I make some things look easier than they really are.

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 28, 2009 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

.
Now, he’s a super2, which I was giving discounts at 20%, 40%, 60%, 80%. However, Keith Law in his blog said that super2 count as 1st year eligibles, and 3+ that were prior super2 count as 2nd year eligible. This really changes the model to something like: 40%, 60%, 80%, 80%.

http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/index.php/site/comments/sabermetric_moves_of_the_2008_pre_season/#429

by R.J. Anderson on Jul 28, 2009 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

What are we arguing about?

There is no NEED to trade off anyone. Wheels is the only one I would due to salary. Sonny’s trade value is probably lower than it should be. While he will command more on the market than Wheels, it will be selling low compared to where he should be. Wheeler provides salary relief and a chance to sell somewhat high.

Follow Me on Twitter @FreeZorilla

by FreeZorilla on Jul 28, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree with this SO hard

as I’ve said before, if we can get Holland for Kaz I’d do it, but then just nix the Lee part until the offseason rolls around where we can better evaluate our needs

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

You should assume league average at best for Davis.

Sonny has proven to be better, plus he’s still cheap.

by R.J. Anderson on Jul 28, 2009 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think arguing his FIP right now would be pissing in the wind considering his actual results have varied from pretty bad to downright horrible all year.

One of the few times where results-based-analysis can outweigh projective analysis.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's been fantastic in Durham.

People are quick to accept that Kazmir got better with some rehabilitation work, why can’t the same work for Sonny?

by R.J. Anderson on Jul 28, 2009 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I stand corrected.

Truth is, Sonny probably IS better, or at least good enough. I’m arguing that I’d like him as an injury reserve, but I’m also saying that I wouldn’t use his FIP as a reason why he should be the injury reserve; I think he should be next in line because he’s probably fixed and would be better right now.

Huh, I guess that doesn’t make a whole lot of sense. Never mind.

I can't wait until we trade him for a reliever.

by kericr on Jul 28, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ambien much?

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

You comment is idiotic and you are drunk with power

AND I’M OUT! Good night everyone. Don’t forget to tip your bartenders and waitresses…

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Great Job Kaz, if it was your last we will miss you

but thanks for helping out as trade bait.

Good night for Tampa and Durham, Sonny goes 8 strong without a walk and EJ hits two HR’s, now averaging a HR per 16.5 PA. He will be quite valuable come September.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:10 PM EDT reply actions  

YOU'RE HERE?!?!

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

YAN FOR CLOSER

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lance Carter has to be available

He’s an ALL STAR!

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I dunno

So was Mark Redman

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good point

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, how can we forget

JASON VERITEK: ALL STAR

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

wait, are you saying Mark Redman's available?!?

problem solved

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

w00t!

FUCK BOSTON

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's gonna screw them over in the end

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mo is old

that is going to be a problem soon sometime for the Yanks

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

So will Jeter at SS

He’ll probably go to 3rd w/ A-Rod going to DH

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeter was trying to get on Sportscenter tonight

Unfortunately for him it will be for the wrong reason.

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

but his jump throws are so sexy

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeter is actually better this year than last

People still are trying to figure that one out, but Mo can pitch probably until he’s like 45 he just never ages pitching wise

by Transplanted on Jul 28, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mo is fine

He had surgery in the off-season & missed ST, he’s fine now. Papelbon has just been all over the place all season

by Transplanted on Jul 28, 2009 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

One of the best games the Rays played tonight

All around it was a great performance. They don’t have to score 15 runs to show that.

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 10:32 PM EDT reply actions  

and how great was it to see Arod and Jeter totally suck in the field?

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

PAPELOLBON

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 28, 2009 10:35 PM EDT reply actions  

OR ... Papelblown

I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer to drink WAY too much of it.

by stpetelawyer on Jul 28, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

maybe he was seeing Bruno last nite

and can’t find the right crease in the strike zone LOL

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Papelboner and Papeldouche also work

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Pap Smear any day of the weak

I can't help that I make some things look easier than they really are.

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 28, 2009 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

He plays RF at NYS

All he has to do is look up and watch it fly into the seats

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah put your worst defender there

he don’t need to do anything since the ball don’t stay in

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

he isn't a bad defender...

you must be doing this to troll me… fucking troll

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

huh?

are you representing the New Yankee Stadium?

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

no, you said put your worst defender there

something Swisher isn’t. I thought you were referring to Swisher being a bad defender so that is why he plays there, I misunderstood, I hope you understand

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

MOAR NEWS
Word from Paul Hoynes at the Cleveland Plain-Dealer is that the Phillies are indeed focusing their attention on Lee. The Indians have intimate knowledge of the Phils’ system after scouting them for a potential C.C. Sabathia deal last summer as well. However, one source from the Indians says the team is likely “closing up shop” on deals before the deadline. We’ll see about that.

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:48 PM EDT reply actions  

does anyone know where Carlos Pena's name came up in trade talk?

I read it earlier but didn’t catch the source. Is this a possibility. If we can somehow turn Los +more into Adrian Gonzalez I would freak, doesn’t he have a decent contract too?

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 10:54 PM EDT reply actions  

Under

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dunno.

I wouldn’t get my hopes up, but they’re working like crazy to add at least Lee.

by R.J. Anderson on Jul 28, 2009 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

We could certainly use a Lee

Kazmir had a awesome night and Garza is one in the future, but no one on this staff has taken control as the man to stop the bleeding. Lee would be the answer.

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

no

just pointing some reasons why Shields isn’t a big star

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

ERA's uselessness is pretty overstated

we all talk a big talk about how batting average and ERA are useless, and while they are obviously the worst stats to use when evaluating a player, they still have a correlation of about 80% to FIP and EQA.

Prospectus put up a chart of the R scored to FIP and EQA a while back. Sorry, no chance I find it.

by digs the long ball on Jul 29, 2009 12:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think he is underrated

He just isn’t a bonafide ace. Is he a #1? It depends how you define a number 1. He certainly is our best starter and is clearly in the top 30 in the league. But where does “ace” status begin? Top 10? Top 5? Top 15? I think he is in the 10 to 20 range, and probably closer to the 2nd half of that range. IMO he isn’t a bonafide ace, but that is just because how I define it. No need to argue semantics.

by matthan on Jul 29, 2009 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

Here
The Rays have shopped Scott Kazmir to the Mets and Rangers, according to Joel Sherman. The Rangers turned down an offer from the Rays and the Mets just had initial interest. The Rays would consider dealing Kazmir, Carlos Pena and even Carl Crawford to free up enough salary to make a blockbuster deal for Martinez and Lee.
The Rays still have interest in Halladay.

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

trading C.C. or Pena to free up space for martinez sounds so stupid

Aybar at 1B, really? I’m not as high as him as most (.329 wOBA last year doesn’t blow me away as it seemed to blow everyone else away, although this year is a difference story), its way too much

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't like this idea either

We lose a ton of speed, CC is one of the most important players here. Victor Martinez is a nice hitter/catcher, but is slow as hell

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

CC chances of being moved are non-existant

Los chances are < 5%

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

and he is a switch-hitter who can hit from both sides.

Navi isn’t having a good hear in both offense/defense.

by sofladude77 on Jul 28, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

again, .700+ OPS the rest of the way, I'm telling you

and his defense has traditionally been better it has been this year, at least in quantifiable aspects like throwing runners out

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

slumping Pena has a .360 wOBA and requires us to give up nothing, and he should progress to around mid .370s at least

I REALLY don’t see Vmart as a need. I could see Lee, and I wouldn’t mind if we were a few games closer (or in the offseason, by all means, throw the kitchen sink at him in the offseason), but Vmart I am adamantly against

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would like Lee + Zaun more than Martinez

considering names being tossed around in connection with Martinez

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

really? what is Zaun's contract status from this point on

if its just a rental for the rest of the year, no, but if we can get a backup and some very good insurance for next year in Navi struggles, or if Navi doesn’t turn it around, then I would do it. Although age is a factor with Zaun.

Is there a split we can exploit with these two?

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm fine with this then, if we can get a platoon thing going (if it makes sense, of course)

I would be very very happy with this, and either of them as full time if the other one struggles. I doubt both of them do. Anything is better than Michel/Riggy

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

we are actually pretty set on back-up catchers

Riggans, Michel, Jaso, and Navi all would make pretty good back-ups. We just need a starter.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jaso would

Riggans and Michel not so much

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

this seems REALLY stupid for the Padres

I guss its possible, but I had heard that Adrian had the kind of pull Halladay is getting. 4 top 150-200 prospects for him is what I kind of assumed, I don’t know why they’d want Pena, they are similar players except Pena is moving from slightly below average park to cavernous and Adrian is going the other way around.

Pena + Talbot is a go-go

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

that makes sense

I would have thought of that, but that is too complicated for me. I still don’t think so, it doesn’t fit the Padres’ needs, which is alot of pieces. If I were the padres I would try to make a rotation from Sonny, Talbot, and Niemann and get like 3 number 3 starters for cheap because of that damn park

by Navi's_Navy on Jul 28, 2009 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

from yahoo

LHP Scott Kazmir wants to stay with the Rays and was curious enough about recent trade rumors that he had agent Brian Peters inquire of Rays executive VP Andrew Friedman about the issue. Kazmir said what they got back was that the talks weren’t serious: “It was very vague; it was nothing. It was just like the talks can happen from wherever, but there’s really nothing to it.”
(Yahoo! Sports)

by behn on Jul 28, 2009 11:05 PM EDT reply actions  

Oh thank the Lord

I can't help that I make some things look easier than they really are.

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 28, 2009 11:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

WAT

TUESDAY: Paul Hoynes reported earlier that the Dodgers might be shifting efforts from Cliff Lee to Sherrill, and Gordon Edes at Yahoo agrees. Edes says the Dodgers could package Elbert as well as third baseman Blake DeWitt to fill in the Orioles’ immediate needs. He also lists the Phillies among four other teams interested in Sherrill.

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 11:06 PM EDT reply actions  

We get it

It wasn’t a good trade

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

No, I just meant that I'm happy the Sox are losing

I have nothing against that trade. We had no use for Kennedy here

by GvilleRay on Jul 28, 2009 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

what are you talking about

you underestimate the value of Joe Dillon’s list’s

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Papeboner's face on MLB.com is priceless

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 11:17 PM EDT reply actions  

9-8 A's

Come the FUCK ON, Bailey

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 11:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Fuck Pedroia

A’s Win!

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 11:27 PM EDT reply actions  

55-46 this year, 59-42 last year

Just gotta win tomorrow and then KC comes in for a fun four

by Transplanted on Jul 28, 2009 11:31 PM EDT reply actions  

I'm really surprised we are only 4 games behind last year's pace

But 6.5 out of first says a lot about how the Yanks have improved.

by acablue on Jul 28, 2009 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

The important thing about that is the post-deadline games become critical

A team like SEA or O’s are gonna be weaker than when we played them earlier, should make for easier pickings. There is a HUGE element about the schedule that has been left out that could be huge, the 11 REMAINING games with Baltimore-whole lot of wins there.

by Transplanted on Jul 29, 2009 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ian Snell

if he is willing to ever pitch in the majors again. Seriously, I love how this kid is refusing to pitch for the Pirates.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 28, 2009 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

EVEN MOAR NEWZ
10:45pm: Adam McCalvy at MLB.com talked to Brewers GM Doug Melvin, who confirmed his discussions with Zduriencik. According to Melvin, Zduriencik “hasn’t decided yet” if he’ll deal a starter. The Brewers were hit hard today, as fill-in Carlos Villanueva allowed five runs in four innings, and the team also discovered that Jeff Suppan has a strained oblique and will be out indefinitely.

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 28, 2009 11:56 PM EDT reply actions  

Okay, seriously

The chick from the Palm Pre commercials creeps me the fuck out

2009 Rays Baseball: Still Kings of the Sunshine State

by JMB on Jul 29, 2009 12:00 AM EDT reply actions  

Lookoutlanding...

" Brignac Escobar Brignac Escobar Brignac Escobar Brignac Escobar

Please be one of the two."

lol

by Doug09 on Jul 29, 2009 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

Little update
UPDATE: My source told me that Clement isn’t sick either. So obviously something is going on. And if you recall, Clement was also given yesterday off. So there’s something being discussed or in process of being finalize. How it involves Clement we aren’t certain.

    Obviously, we heard the talk of the three-way trade earlier this week, in which Clement and Brandon Morrow would go to the Indians, Cliff Lee and possibly Victor Martinez would go to the Rays and then Scott Kazmir and Reid Brignac would come to Seattle.

    That deal seemed to be off the table, especially with the Red Sox and Phillies pushing to get Lee instead.

    But remember many of the perceived deals that we thought Jack Z was going to make, end up being different than suspected.

by Doug09 on Jul 29, 2009 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

MLBTR comment

“Maybe a red sox trade?”

Waddadouche

by Doug09 on Jul 29, 2009 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

His name is "O4 Forever"

Huuuuuge douche

Swav or Die (>'-')> <('-')> <('-'<)
For the lulz

by SRQman on Jul 29, 2009 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

MLBTR comment... this can't be fair... can it?

Mariners Get:

3B Matt Gamel
C Angel Salome
SP Manny Parra

Brewers Get:

C Jeff Clement
SP Jarrod Washburn

by Doug09 on Jul 29, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hahahahahahahaha

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

ed_price# Indians and #Rays scouted top #Angels prospect LHP Trevor Reckling tonight (7 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 9 K in AA).

by Dbullsfan on Jul 29, 2009 12:53 AM EDT reply actions  

Huh

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not you, us scouting

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 12:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

Don't love him. He could be very good though.

His scouting report has been posted, so I don’t need to go through that. Hitter cannot elevate the ball against him, which is awesome. He’s also extremely young, which doesn’t matter when it comes to ceiling, but it gives him significantly more time to develop command, which he currently doesn’t have.

Tools Whore

by Tyler on Jul 29, 2009 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Looks like Reckling has had some control problems this year (1.59 K/BB)

But still the #2 prospect in Angels system according to Minor League Ball,and he is only 20
http://www.minorleagueball.com/2008/12/31/706285/los-angeles-angels-top-20

“Reckling’s fastball resides in the upper 80s, but it can touch the low 90’s and could add velocity as he matures. His specialty, however, is a terrific curveball that could be his ticket the majors.

Eddie Bane, the director of scouting for the Angels, had this to say about Reckling last fall in an interview at theangelswin.com: "Trevor Reckling is a HS lefty that we got because of the hard work of Greg Mohrhardt and Mike Silvestri. That being said, I would have been extremely unhappy if we did not sign this young man. He has a legit Zito type curve and he is striking out everybody in Arizona. We are happy with Trevor."

by GvilleRay on Jul 29, 2009 1:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

Per Baseball America

Strengths: Reckling could have three pitches that grade better than average. His drop-off-the-table curveball has the most upside. He spots his 87-91 mph fastball to both sides of the plate and down in the strike zone. His changeup may be his most dependable pitch, which is unusual for a teenager. He’s a good athlete with a smooth delivery, and he does a nice job of staying on top of his pitches with a high-three-quarters arm slot.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/online/prospects/rankings/organization-top-10-prospects/2009/267258.html

Swav or Die (>'-')> <('-')> <('-'<)
For the lulz

by SRQman on Jul 29, 2009 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Washburn/Clement/Lowe to Boston for Jed Lowrie.

Silly MLBTR commenters

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:00 AM EDT reply actions  

Apparently it's been reported somewhere

Someone on a different message board posted it too.

www.raysprospects.com

by Imperialism32 on Jul 29, 2009 1:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Theo Epstein isn't that retarded

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Trading Lowrie for Clement is great

Washburn is probably the cost of doing buisness.

www.raysprospects.com

by Imperialism32 on Jul 29, 2009 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Washburn would be a starter....In Fenway.

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

With THAT contract

for a GOOD young SS

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Good?

Really? He’s average at best.

www.raysprospects.com

by Imperialism32 on Jul 29, 2009 1:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Kid can field. bat is decent for a SS

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Can he field?

From BA before the 2008 season: Weaknesses: While Lowrie can play shortstop and his offensive production makes his glove more tolerable, a contender probably would still want a better defender at the position

Average. Unless he got a lot better in 08/09.

www.raysprospects.com

by Imperialism32 on Jul 29, 2009 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

UZR has him as good in his career

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

No, which is also weird

Since Morrow Clement for Brignac/Kitty kaz will still allow them to fleece the Brewers on a washburn deal

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

well i hope its true

Washburn and Clement instead of Halladay/Lee and V-Mart would be nice.

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

I dunno Youkilis/Lowell for 3B

Youk, Laroche, and Gonzalez all for 1B?

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

More importantly: Nick green at SS? LOL

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hell yeah

I hope that rumor actually has some truth to it

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

this is why I don't get the deal

Lowrie is there future at SS, they don’t have any other options in system. I guess they could pick one up during FA if there are any available.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 29, 2009 1:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

prob find a way to pick up Escobar

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

Alcedis

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

No way the Brewers trade him for something the sox sell

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

wait

back to Yunel

maybe they will trade a 1B or OF to Braves and try to pick him up

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

I kinda hope the Brewers don't give up any of there young guys

unless to us obviously

but a Gamel/Escobar/Weeks/Fielder infield sounds sexy in the future for the Brewers

by Dbullsfan on Jul 29, 2009 1:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

ESPECIALLY since Casey kelly is going to be a pitcher

Brad Ziegler had a scoreless inning streak. Brad Ziegler had not met BJ Upton.

by P Brady on Jul 29, 2009 1:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

SRQ!!

Cept he a Sailor

Swav or Die (>'-')> <('-')> <('-'<)
For the lulz

by SRQman on Jul 29, 2009 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree it seems a bit packed

but it was just as packed b4 this trade and there was talk they were interested.

by Dbullsfan on Jul 29, 2009 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Can his D suck more than Tek?

His bat should be better for sure.

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

We should trade for Erick Aybar

Just to have two Aybars in time for the Flo Rida concert

by GvilleRay on Jul 29, 2009 1:06 AM EDT reply actions  

no we need the Upton's!

for all that’s holy

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

not just the same name

arent they brothers?

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

RJ hasnt posted in a while

Its getting my hopes up for some good news

1. James Shields 2. Scott Kazmir 3. Matt Garza 4. David Price 5. Jeff Niemann

by joeybw on Jul 29, 2009 1:32 AM EDT reply actions  

Just saw the highlights

How many drinks did Nick Swisher have during batting practice? He was starting to channel his inner “Willie Mays in the 1973 World Series” out there in right.

by untexan on Jul 29, 2009 3:10 AM EDT reply actions  

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