Tampa Bay Rays Sign Matt Moore To 5 Year, $14M Deal
by Steve Slowinski on Dec 9, 2011 11:07 AM EST
in Tampa Bay Rays News
Email
Print
This news from Jerry Crasnick, ESPN:
#Rays reach agreement with pitcher Matt Moore on 5-year, guaranteed $14M contract, source says
The deal includes several club options that could raise value to $37.5M over 8 years. It could top $40M if he hits escalators. #Rays
So the Rays now have Matt Moore locked up for eight years for a maximum of $40 million? Well, I guess he'll be starting 2012 in the majors.
Moore analysis (couldn't resist) on this move and its implications below the jump.
Make no mistake: this deal is an absolute bargain. As he showed at the end of last season, Matt Moore is one of the best pitching prospects in all of baseball, and through this stage of his career, he compares favorably to such studs as Stephen Strasburg, Tim Lincecum, Tommy Hanson, and Jered Weaver.
Through his Arb2 season -- which is where Moore's guaranteed part of the deal ends and the option years pick up -- Tim Lincecum made $27 million (and will get a haul in arbitration this year). Jered Weaver was paid $13 million over those years, but then signed a 5 year, $85 million extension that pays him an average of $17 million per year.
So not only are the Rays getting a great value on Moore through the first five seasons of his career ($2.8 million AAV), they're also getting a bargain on his Arb3 season and two years of free agency ($8.5 million AAV).
This move is absolutely crucial for the Rays' long term success, as David Price's current situation shows. The Rays waited to sign Price to an extension -- or else he didn't want to sign one initially, who knows? -- and he's now set to get a hefty raise in arbitration this season. Considering Price will likely make $7-8 million in Arb1 this season, he will likely get around $12-13 million in 2013 and become instant trade fodder. And if the Rays were to approach him about an extension right now, odds are that Price would not be willing to take enough of a "hometown discount" in order to make the long-term risk viable for the Rays.
So unless the Rays wanted to risk losing another ace pitcher after only a handful of seasons, they had to lock up Moore before he became a star. Now that they have him signed for eight seasons, it makes the idea of losing Price more palatable; after all, both Price and Moore are hard-throwing lefties, and Moore has shown he has a good chance of becoming as good a pitcher as Price, if not better.
With this move, the Rays now have some impressive long-term starting pitching depth:
Moore is essentially going to be the Rays' ace that they build around for the next eight years, and they'll be able to match him up with Shields for (hopefully) the next 2-3 seasons. And despite Davis' poor showing last season, it still seems likely to me that the Rays keep him due to his upside and his contract status. Even if he only ever becomes a league average starter, he's valuable at that price.
Next up on the extension train? Jeremy Hellickson, pretty please.
305 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
there it is
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
This is an amazing deal and opens up a ton of options.
This almost assures we are trading a starter for offense now.
2 thoughts
Upon looking up to read the news
To the front office group that made this happen
I'm not a fanboy, I'm an awesome dude
by Jason Collette on Dec 9, 2011 11:12 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
That's the best part of it, IMO
Hell, we can trade two starters and still have someone decent on reserve in AAA. I just hope they’re able to maximize the value, even if it means trading Price.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
Only fear here is how this affects Price
Team locks up the kid before going after its top profile pitcher. I know it takes two sides to tango, but the first phone call I’m making is to him and talking it out.
I'm not a fanboy, I'm an awesome dude
I don't think Price really has any room to be upset as long as the Rays have made a good effort to extend him.
He understands that this is for the better of the team. He understood why he got sent down in 2009 and he knows the same thing would happen to Moore. This move is more significant in a going for it over the next couple years as it allows moves to be made that will improve the offense this offseason.
Pretty sure it would take a lot more than 37.5 million to lock up Price.
I would assume the money is still there to do so.
by PriceMultiCyYoungs on Dec 9, 2011 11:22 AM EST up reply actions
didn't Price mention wanting to sign an extension yesterday?
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:23 AM EST up reply actions
yep
I'm not a fanboy, I'm an awesome dude
by Jason Collette on Dec 9, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
He must have been aware of the Moore deal, got him excited
by Ben Tumbling on Dec 9, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
this isn't a bad framework for a Price deal
obviously you don’t get the first two years at sub-million-dollar prices, but you could buy out all 4 option years and then have team options for years 1 and 2 of free agency.
That would probably be something like 4/40 with 2 option years at $15MM each. That seems doable on both sides, right?
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
unless he's getting moved
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
true, sign and trade, but I just don't see that happening.
if price gets signed then wade or niems is certainly moved, likely niems. i really don’t see either going to the bullpen.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
remember Price already has made millions
Moore was a later draft pick, Much more incentive to sign a long-term deal immediately.
by raysfaninminnesota on Dec 9, 2011 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
I came before I had a chance to get a boner
by Ben Tumbling on Dec 9, 2011 11:22 AM EST up reply actions
i would argue that with his success the last 3 years, what he did to the Yanks/Rangers, and now with this contract
he’s the most valuable trade chip in baseball.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
Longoria still more valuable
But ajif;asdkfj;dlsafjadk
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
4 years of longoria vs. 8 years of moore?
dunno…it’s pretty difficult. even more difficult if Moore produces around ~3 WAR for his rookie season which is about what I’m expecting.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
also I'm talking about today, not the deals overall. Longo's deal will always be remarkable for how teamfriendly and tradable it was.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
Longoria is locked for 5 more years and has already proven himself to be a perennial MVP caliber player whereas Moore is still a bit of an unknown (although as much of a sure thing as a pitcher who has like 15 innings above AAA can be)
I think most teams would rather have his contract than Moore’s right now
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
Proud Papa
I just have to share this picture of Matt Moore teaching my son how to pitch at Durham last year:
I figured folks would want to commemorate
the last time you’ll ever see Matt Moore wearing Durham Bulls gear. :)
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
no, Baltimore
I just head down to Durham for the baseball camp and to watch quality AAA games.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
wow, that's quite a committment you made there!
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
very cool
I’ve got a DC office — let’s go get a beer sometime
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Alright everyone, now I take back what I said about the Trout deal..8 years of Moore cost-controlled > 6 years of trout with 3 arbs.
only in light of this new deal though.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
also, this means he's starting next season with us. YESSSSS
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
this makes Matt Moore the second-most valuable commodity in baseball
after Evan Longoria. Wow.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
can't wait until 2020 when they're 3B and SP of the New York Yankees
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
after we've won 8 WS
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
I like Cobb as a starter. Groundballs galore
With our defense. I also wouldn’t mind Davis in the bullpen
Great move Friedman does it again
I love everything about the Rays front office and team. I hope the next move is to lock up BJ Upton long term. GO RAYS.
Is this the news?
Tampa Bay Rays to hold a press conference this afternoon to make a major announcement.
More Of Moore!!
Price to the Royals for Eric Hosner? Would the Royals do it?
Yeah, I am starting to think Price won't be here 18 months from now
by Dome Biscuit on Dec 9, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
wait for the second shoe to fall
Price hasn’t even gone to arb1 yet. I think AF gets something done.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
Now, isn't this more fun
than doling out $254 million over 10 years to Pujols and $77.5 million over 5 years for Wilson?
by bobr on Dec 9, 2011 11:32 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
especially when I'd argue that Moore is already better than Wilson now
by raysfaninminnesota on Dec 9, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
see: Game 1, 2011 ALDS
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
god the only thing terrible about the highlight reel of Moore's strikeouts that day is his explosive acne.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
Friedman, how do you continue to amaze us?
I wonder how quick this guy would of turned Houston around.
What a awesome deal in so many ways.
Under construction
he's so dreamy
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
WOULD HAVE WOULD HAVE WOULD HAVE
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
Structure:
I’m guessing he gets a nice bonus ($2 million?) and the buyout is about the same. That leaves $10 for the 5 guaranteed years: .1, 1, 2, 3, 3? Then the options would be like 8, 9, 10.5? Then the escalators to get it to $40? God, that’s MONTE.
first two years are 850K
so probably a little steeper than that. But yeah, this is a hell of a deal.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:39 AM EST up reply actions
So Angels get CJ Wilson for 75 million
Rays get Matt Moore for 14 Million….hmmm
Yeah, yeah, it's 1 game
But I think of ALDS game 1 then look at those numbers and that’s just funny.
Under construction
Yeah, I'll take age and less $$$ though
Just praying he has a healthy career
by Dome Biscuit on Dec 9, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
I PRAISE YOU 24/7!!!!!! AND THIS HOW YOU DO ME!!!!! YOU EXPECT ME TO LEARN FROM THIS? HOW?!!! ILL NEVER FORGET THIS!! EVER!!! THX THO…
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
the world's been waiting 6,000 years for this contract!
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
by pudieron89 on Dec 9, 2011 11:48 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
i don't know what this is but i enjoyed it anyways.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
supposed to be: dude, SCIENCE says that baseball is at least $3 million years old. Grow a brain!
But my keyboard does this weird thing where it jumps around, and I have no idea why I put a dollar sign. Hopped up on caffeine and my blood flow is all diverted southward.
i just figured it was a new york bankers thing
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
That's right, keep all the aces around AF!
Fay also mentions that Wade Davis and Jeff Niemann could be on the Reds’ radar, as well, and adds that the Reds’ top two trade chips, Yonder Alonso and Yasmani Grandal, would be fits for the Rays. It might take more than that to get Shields, but the Reds probably aren’t willing to part with Devin Mesoraco. The Rays have insisted that Shields isn’t going anywhere, but they’ll listen to all offers.
Friedman should just say “See that Moore deal? You know I am getting Yonder and Grandal and not giving up Shields so just agree now and get it over with”
Under construction
Davis+Niemann for Alonso+Grandal y/n?
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
Fair enough
I guess I’m assuming Cobb bounces back
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
If he's ready to go in ST, then yes. If he's not, then probably not.
Locking in Moore allows us to start him in the Bigs, but I’m not sure I’m ready for one of Archer/Torres to start there.
Neither am I
But if push comes to shove I rather have Yasmani learning backstop from Molina than Davis pitching instead of Torres
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
Yasmani's very floor seems to be an above average big league catcher
And he could well be a star.
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
perhaps Davis/Niemann and Torres/Archer/Colome
gets a deal done.
by raysfaninminnesota on Dec 9, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
This is usually true.
That being said, they can have both pitchers if it’s Meseroco instead. He will be awesome and he will do it this year.
Under construction
No way I do both of those guys for JUST Mesorasco. You have to be SURE you're getting McCann.
Catchers are terrifying because they only play 120 games a year and break down a ton.
I think he meant
you trade both Niemann and Davis if you can get both Alonso and Mesoraco. I agree, but I don’t see Cincy doing that.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
no way cincy trades both
they already got rid of ramon hernandez…
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
He has a + glove by all regards and with a league average glove/baserunning you need to put up a ~.300 wOBA
Did you see Yasmani’s numbers last year in the minors?
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
yeah... but he just hit so well last year and has such a good pedigree
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
maybe, but still. there's no catcher prospect whose floor is that.
i like him, but thats just how i feel.
catcher is so risky...
but mesoraco and grandal are great prospects…they might be exceptions.
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
the blue jays also have some serious catching depth...
although i dont know how likely a interdivision trade would be.
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
Worst case scenario
McGee can start for a while
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
I want those two pretty bad
But, Friedman would never trade 2 starters in 1 deal. He would need a lot more than that, anyway.
Under construction
Two starters we have replacements for in exchange for 2 position players who immediately fill dire needs of the team
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
No, I agree with that part
We have Moore and Cobb replace them and it’s awesome.
We have no depth really if we do that, however. Alex Torres would be #6 and then it’s hoping Archer is ready because Sonny better never start again.
Under construction
You also have Colome as well.
I’d love to have a 3 Alex rotation, but that would mean one of Price/Shields is gone.
that's tough
I think you have to get a third player out of that deal. Still, I want to point out that the Rays could do that and still be left with a rotation of Price/Shields/Moore/Hellickson and then Cobb/Torres/Archer for the 5th spot.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, that's the reasoning I was using. I probably do that deal though
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
OI;QEWAJLRKFROAESIUFR093WPOREIQW8JTAES;LIJRES;ALFRASDL;HFADS;LFHJADSL;JFSADFSDAF
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:44 AM EST reply actions
i think there's a curse word in there somewhere. mods, please remove this.
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
not yet, but it will evolve into one
by raysfaninminnesota on Dec 9, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah we probably aren't extending him
(probably=definitely)
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Yes, he is
Same problem with Jennings.
Price…well, he fell out of awesome contract extension range after his 2010 year.
Under construction
i agree
i dont see price getting a team friendly extension…he will hold out for the big bucks. I think this is the end of Jeff Niemann
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
Helly and Jennings would be ideal. I'm not sure I see Price happening at this point unless he's willing to take a steep discount.
Joyce is likely happening, though, so that’s something.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously. -- @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Dec 9, 2011 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
Even if Rays don't add much in FA (although I'd be shocked if they don't get something via trade for Niemann/Davis when it's all said and done)
but Jennings and Moore for a full-season is a pretty awesome addition!
by raysfaninminnesota on Dec 9, 2011 11:52 AM EST reply actions
Players I would like to see signed in this manner (for whom it's actually feasible still) are Joyce and Deezy
Anyone else is probably already too wealthy/has been too good at the big league level
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:55 AM EST reply actions
Jennings wont be easy (Boras is lurking)
Joyce, I can see that happening any day now.
Under construction
Jennings is unlikely, but remotely possible. I think Hellickson is unlikely given that he was Rookie of the Year already
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Jennings' background seems like he might be a good candidate.
Not a high pick, so smaller bonus. He’s from rural AL, so I doubt he comes from much money.
2 PM press conference for Moore
I don’t think that’s going to be on TV though, since, you know, we didn’t throw 254 million at him.
Under construction
i think this is a better signing per dollar than pujols.
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
I think this is a better signing per dollar than pujols.
FTFY
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
i think we should get Bob Costas
to ask Albert how old he is the way he asked Jerry Sandusky if he was sexually attracted to young boys…"am I older than what my “birth certificate says” well umm well i really like being around young people…umm yeah , but umm I am only 31."
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
Love it. Love it! LOVE IT!!!!!!
These are the kind of deals that will keep the Rays competitive. High risk. Way higher reward.
Something clever...
Low risk! If those 14M go down the drain that's still barely anything
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
Consider my reply to Torrez a replay to this as well
adding a caveat that I watched firsthand as Rick Ankiel imploded. That was not fun.
Something clever...
that's a fair point
in December of 1999, I would have applauded a deal like this for Ankiel as well.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
It'd be fair to call this high risk high reward if the Rays signed Moore to an 8/40 deal straight up
But this is a 5/14 deal where, if we like what we get, we can make it into an 8/40 deal. Completely different
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 3:42 PM EST up reply actions
I'd consider nearly any extension for a pitcher
a pretty significant risk. Injuries…SSS and whatnot. Doesn’t make the deal any less awesome.
Something clever...
well, what enables the Rays to make this deal
is their proven medical history with pitchers. So really, if Moore pitches just two years out of the next five and then blows his arm out, this deal is probably still a win.
You’re right that I’m being a bit glib with “essentially zero risk” — but I don’t think this is a particularly risky move at all.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
friedman is the master of minimizing risk
this is just his most recent example of this…even if moore is just a MOR starter this deal will still be team friendly and well worth it…I mean aaron harhang just got 2/12 in LA.
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
You have to make this deal either way
But I can’t help thinking Friedman is very close to trading one of his SP’s so he locked Moore up.
Sorry Cobb, you had to know that Moore was better, though.
Under construction
Obvious but still obviously awesome...
Moore wasn’t going anywhere regardless of this contract, as he was under team control for a full six seasons. Still, there was a chance the Rays would have held him in the minors for part of 2012 with the intent of controlling him for a seventh year or avoiding Super Two status. This contract likely removes that scenario, making Moore a stronger candidate for the Rays’ Opening Day rotation and increasing the likelihood Shields, Davis, or Jeff Niemann is traded this offseason.
the real savings is going to come in the arbitration hearings...
lets say moore wins rookie of the year in 2012 the deal ensures that the more success he has the cheaper he will cost.
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
which, under the new rules
he would be unless the Rays sent him back to Durham until July.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 9, 2011 12:27 PM EST up reply actions
Wow, at first I heard it was only 5 years/$14M, and was thrilled
But to hear it could be EIGHT years? 40M? Holy moly this is why I love rooting for this team.
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
those last 3 years are all club options
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
Yeah, I got that part
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 2:32 PM EST up reply actions
A new catcher for newly-signed Matt Moore? Meh.
The Rays and Mets could be among the suitors for Ivan Rodriguez, who is working out in Miami, tweets Jon Heyman of MLB Network.
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry, this isn't supposed to be a reply
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, not 2 Jose Molina's
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 12:36 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed, I'd much rather see Lobaton/Chirinos
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
We would have some amazing defense behind the plate to frame those pitches for Helly and Moore
But if possible, we may be worse on offense than 2011 behind the plate.
Under construction
I was really just trying to test my new twitter follow button
Boom. Outta Here.
Follow @RyanGilliss
by Ryan Gilliss on Dec 9, 2011 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
Good to have a happy moment before Dwight gets traded to the Nets..........
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
lol that's true
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 12:42 PM EST up reply actions
lol oh Friedman
It’s only a rumor but he asked for Ike Davis and Neise for Upton.
Under construction
Where did you hear this from?
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 12:46 PM EST up reply actions
I gotta sign off twitter
Bunch of people on there were saying he wanted that for Upton.
Makes no sense that he would ask for a pitcher, though. Probably not true.
Under construction
no trade upton, trade pitcher
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
HERS'S A QUESTION (or 3):
1.) if the Rays decide to trade Jeff Neimann what do you think they would get?
2.) if the Rays decide to trade Wade Davis what do you think they would get?
3.) if the Rays decide to trade Jeff Neimann and Wade Davis what do you think they would get?
I still think, because they are blocked
1) Yonder or Grandal
2) Yonder or Grandal
3) Yonder and Grandal
Under construction
by joeybw on Dec 9, 2011 1:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Jeff Neimann
I just dont see the Reds dealing Yonder or Grandal for Neimann alone.
by James Westfall on Dec 9, 2011 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
Nope, it would probably take Davis to get either
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
I have a feeling we are going to see a trade announced soon
Seems like shit is starting to fall into place.
Crap, I'm so off today, this is a reply to the Snarfalicious post
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
PoW suggests on FB that the Rays trade Price for HanRam AND LoMo.
I don’t want Price gone but damn son.
by PriceMultiCyYoungs on Dec 9, 2011 1:34 PM EST reply actions
Id be all for a Price HanRam swap if we can afford him
by Dbullsfan on Dec 9, 2011 1:38 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'd accept that trade without hesitating.
But there’s no way the Marlins do that, imo
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
MooreMultiCyYoungs if that happens.
(HAT TIP TO FORMER DRB’ER PLAY ON WORDS)
by PriceMultiCyYoungs on Dec 9, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
I would rather do Shields/Upton.
I believe we may still get Price and a year or two of free agency. I also believe he’ll still reach elite status.
If we could somehow add those two without moving Upton our lineup would be BOSS.
by PriceMultiCyYoungs on Dec 9, 2011 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
This trade is really similar to something Harold Reynolds proposed on MLB network.
He said HanRam and LoMo for King Felix. When I saw that, it made me think of HanRam and LoMo for Price. The other trade I thought of that I think could work for both teams was HanRam and LoMo for Shields and Guyer. With how bad LoMo’s D has been in LF in SSS, I think Guyer the LF is as good as LoMo the LF. Even if you think LoMo is more valuable, that would help to offset the extra 18 million that is owed to HanRam. A Longo, Hanley, Zobrist, LoMo infield would make me very happy. Rosterbating is so much fun sometimes.
Ken_Rosenthal Ken Rosenthal
One member of #Marlins drawing more trade interest than any other: @LoMoMarlins. Highly, highly unlikely that team will move him. #MLB
by PriceMultiCyYoungs on Dec 9, 2011 1:56 PM EST reply actions
There's no reason why the Marlins should trade anybody right now.
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
Wow
Annual sals for #Rays Moore on new deal: $1M in ’12, $1M ’ 13, $1M ’14, $3M ’15, $5M ’16, $7M option ’17, $9.5M option ’18, $10M option ’19
Under construction
Pretty much spot on but trade the signing bonus for the last season of the guaranteed years and subtract a mill from the third season for $3 mill buyout:
That leaves $10 for the 5 guaranteed years: .1, 1, 2, 3, 3? Then the options would be like 8, 9, 10.5? Then the escalators to get it to $40? God, that’s MONTE.
by rglass44 on Dec 9, 2011 11:37 AM EST reply actions
Oh, Friedman
Friedman said the #Rays have discussed movng one of starters into pen, Friedman very optimistic about #MattMoore
I just found that funny because in the same interview he said “new contract doesn’t necessarily mean Moore makes opening day roster”
Under construction
I'm guessing the "moving one of starters into pen" is Torres.
With Davis/Niemann traded, Moore is easily the #5 starter (if not, #4). If our commited salary is about $50-$52 after the Moore deal, trading Davis or Niemann for a cheap, young 1B should give us at least $1M back, so about $50M after that.
That leaves us with needs at DH and maybe another RP, so I figured our payroll sits at about $57M, but if a guy like Willingham signs it could be up to $60M, with our needs filled.
That’s a winning team, but it will be tougher to make the playoffs with the Angles loading up, and we can’t expect the Yankees or Red Sox to collapse. This is the year we need to make something happen, with possible free agents and contracts getting expensive after this year.
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
Huh? The Rays payroll is around $42m, and won't be impacted much at all by the Moore deal.
Torres will probably be in Triple-A to start the year. He still has some things to work on.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Dec 9, 2011 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
Well, I was including raises in last years contracts and projected arbitration
I didn’t make that very clear
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 9, 2011 7:53 PM EST up reply actions
Pretty sure I am too.
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Dec 9, 2011 11:18 PM EST up reply actions
Wait, but the payroll last year was $42M,
so with all the raises in contracts and arbitration, plus signings of Molina and Moore, It should be about $50M. I might not be thinking right, but all this offseason I was thinking we were at about $47M with needs at C, 1B, DH, and RP.
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 10, 2011 10:46 AM EST up reply actions
Plus, the arbitration numbers you have are lower than MLBTR's projections, which I am using.
Adding that money, plus Molina and Moore signings, I have a little over $5M more than your projections, so it sits more around $48M than $50M.
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 10, 2011 10:58 AM EST up reply actions
We also cut ManRam and Damon, did you include those?
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 10, 2011 1:51 PM EST up reply actions
I believe I did
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 10, 2011 4:28 PM EST up reply actions
I'm sorry. I was also including like 14 players being paid the minimum in there.
So after that was included, it does sit at around $50M. But obviously you didn’t know that because I didn’t tell you. I might write up a FanPost on this sometime soon…..:)
I AM THE MONSTER - The big SCARY monsta
by sc_monsta1015 on Dec 10, 2011 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
Niemann sent to the pen? Davis given another shot or traded
doubt payroll is raised 18mil.
#WD4Bullpen
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
Follow @steveslow
by Steve Slowinski on Dec 9, 2011 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
Wade Davis, Bullpen Pitcher
The challenge with Davis is that just about all his value right now is in how long/cheap his deal is, and not in his prowess on the mound.
Davis isn’t one of the six best TB starters, and doesn’t deserve a spot in even an expanded rotation in 2012. Niemann might be under control for less time, but it would be foolish to deal him and keep Davis only because Davis is cheaper longer. Deal Niemann, and ou’re stuck with Wade Davis in your rotation for two more years, probably out-earning his meager salary, but not helping you win the AL East.
Using him in the bullpen is inefficient in anything more than the short-term of a single year in 2012. Davis is going to make $1.5MM next year and $2.8MM in 2013, so due to Rays payroll constraints, he has to be gone by Opening Day 2013 to not be a bad deal, in which the Rays are paying nearly $3 million for 50 innings of Wade Davis, Bullpen Pitcher.
I think the best thing is to find a taker for Davis ASAP, see if Jocketty thinks the Pujols/Fielder exodus opens up the Central for him in 2012 and will let Alonso or Mesoraco or Yasmani Grandal go for an “experienced, established starting pitcher who, Walt, can really help you guys this year”, or if KC or someone who is just starting to break through but in need of a back-end 1-2-WAR SP would give up a nice piece in return. I have a hard time seeing a future for Wade Davis in TB.
It's a big "if" that he's elite though
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 4:25 PM EST up reply actions
If you define elite as sub-3 true talent level FIP then yes, it's far from guaranteed
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
i mean relief ace...
there’s a difference between a “big ‘if’” and being “guaranteed.” will he be a top 25ish RP (about the amount of guys that mean that qualification from 2009-2011)? i dont know, but id put the odds at higher than “a big if.”
I know, I'm saying that it's unlikely he's an elite reliever though, and more likely that he's a "good" one
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
It’s possible Davis would be a capable reliever, but not a “good” one, IMO.
You don’t want a guy who is striking out 5-6 per 9IP, and walking over half that, who is a fly ball pitcher prone to giving up HR working in any kind of high-leverage situations. And Wade Davis is that pitcher.
Similarly, you don’t want to have a low-leverage ROOGy or a mop-up guy who primarily works 3+ run margin situations at $2.8MM/year, which is where Davis will be in a year.
If he relives this year, his trade value plummets due to the 2013 salary and every team in MLB having a RHP with a fastball/slider combo that can miss bats better than Davis for three outs once every four days.
I think now is the time to deal Davis and get as much as you can for him. I can’t see him being a long-term answer for the team, or his trade value being any higher in 3 months, 7 months, 12 months, 24 months than it is now. I’m fairly sure Friedman sees this, and will deal him for the best possible package in the next month or so.
I agree with basically everything you say actually
Although I think there’s more of a chance of Wade being a shutdown reliever than you admit, it’s not worth the risk to try him in the pen for sure
by benderbrodriguez on Dec 9, 2011 7:48 PM EST up reply actions
He's not an elite RP
He lacks the stuff to miss enough bats to be an elite RP. He arguably lacks the stuff to be any kind of RP other than the guy who mops up a blowout for an inning or two.
Farnsworth strikes out well over 2 more per 9. He walks 1.2 or so less per 9. He allows a lot less HR. He induces a hek of a lot fewer GB. Even reducing Davis’ IP by a third and eliminating the 2nd, 3rd, and (very rare) 4th time through the lineup factor, he’s not catching up to Farnsworth.
True, but all the combined effects do not do enough to make Wade Davis an effective enough relief pitcher to justify a roster spot at $2.8 million on a team in which that would represent about 6% of total payroll. He will never have that bat-missing stuff that every good high-leverage pitcher needs.
Best front office in baseball right now (up there with Texas)
Longo, Zobrist, and Moore deals will prove to be 3 of the top long-term deals handed out this decade.
Rays in '08.... Desmond Jennings - the breakout continues.....
They wouldn't all be this decade.
Am I the only one flagging this guy?
Seriously, do we have to wait for the money shot or a "F*** THE SOXXXXXX!" before we ban him? Doubleteapot… BAN HIM!!
by AlohaSox on Sep 28, 2011 10:20 PM CDT
by SandalsNoPants on Dec 11, 2011 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
weALREADYknow
"I don't always post off-topic, but when I do, I post at http://ottotd.com" - $tinky $tu
that's dramatic understatement
no other FO in the game is close to the Rays — certainly not Texas.
by AndrewTorrez on Dec 11, 2011 5:02 PM EST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Please read our Community Guidelines.
Related FanPosts on DRaysBay
Related FanShots on DRaysBay
![Matt Moore Wallpaper I made. :]
Here's the direct link
http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb472/lewiedesigns/Wallpapers/mattmoore1440by900.jpg](http://cdn1.sbnation.com/fan_shot_images/234065/mattmoore1440by900_small.jpg)
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
DRB Suggestion Box
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- College player makes impossible over the fence catch to save tournament game (Video)
- Security!: Camden Yards guard collides with Royals’ Mike Moustakas
- The Juice: Nelson Cruz matches career high eight RBIs, Pujols stays hot in Seattle
- Benches clear at Fenway as Red Sox-Rays rivalry heats up
- Keeping good company: Albert Pujols becomes fourth-youngest player to hit 450 home runs
