Rays 2011 Spring Training Statistics
The Rays 25-man roster has almost been whittled to its final form. It appears Elliot Johnson, on the merit of a Rays Spring Training record 8 steals, has -- quite literally -- stolen the bench role. Meanwhile, Casey Kotchman's strong performance thus far has caught many eyes, but not dethroned Dan Johnson at first base.
Spring Training stats are hard to come, but maybe that's a good thing. Frankly, these statistics don't matter. I think many of us remember Akinori Iwamura inaugural spring with the team. He went something like 0 for 70 billion, and then promptly began the season with a hit streak.
Well, with that caveat given, here's the 2011 spring's statistics through yesterday's 11 run drubbing.
NOTE: I've manually calculated BABIP, wOBA, and FIP. Since I originally took the data from CBS's website, I did not have IBB (for FIP and wOBA) or RBOE (for wOBA). Not that it really matters -- RBOE has a VERY small affect on wOBA, and I don't think there are usually many (if any) IBB in the spring.
Some notes:
- First of all, it's hard to miss the BABIPs in the first baseman battle. Johnson, despite slugging .543, has an unluckily low BABIP, while Kotchman's BABIP looks pretty fortunate. This maybe played into Maddon's calculus when he proclaimed Johnson the early leader.
- Ben Zobrist?! Man he's hit well. I feel like he's had a quiet spring, but it surely doesn't look like it from here.
- Also, a bad BABIP hasn't hurt Kelly Shoppach's spring. I think there's little doubt his 2011 season should improve our perceptions of him.
- Is anyone else excited about Johnny Damon and Manny Ramirez?
- Joel Peralta and Rob Delaney have both exceeded my expectations thus far. Let's hope they keep it up.
- And, wow, Jeff Niemann has looked pretty slick thus far. If he can keep healthy this year, he's going to be one of the best #4 starters in the AL, say I.
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I think EJ is up to 11 steals this spring after a 3 steal game yesterday (or the day prior).
Maddon's Mission
Make you want to kill him, then make you want to love him. Sly.
by Jonah Keri on Jun 19, 2010 10:31 PM EDT
by Doug09 on Mar 25, 2011 7:17 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
hmmm... Maybe these stats are a day short...
I’ll look into it in a big.
A DRaysBay writer from Cubs Stats and Twitter @BradleyWoodrum
DO YOUR JOB WOODRUM
http://www.mlb.com/news/boxscore.jsp?gid=2011_03_24_tbamlb_houmlb_1
BASERUNNING
SB: Johnson, E 3 (11, 2nd base off Norris/Towles, 2nd base off Norris/Towles, 3rd base off Norris/Towles)
I’m kidding. It’s hard to find spring training stats, so I’m glad you gathered these numbers up in a nice little table.
Maddon's Mission
Make you want to kill him, then make you want to love him. Sly.
by Jonah Keri on Jun 19, 2010 10:31 PM EDT
Sure enough, these stats are old. I'll have this updated within the hour.
A DRaysBay writer from Cubs Stats and Twitter @BradleyWoodrum
DanJo is never going to have even a league average BABIP--think about it
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I don't follow.
We saw last year that he has a really good power factor (PF), meaning when he puts it in play, he puts it in play hard. Also, he’s not Paul Konerko slow, so you wouldn’t expect that to hurt him either.
It might be a little low, but it won’t be .100s low.
A DRaysBay writer from Cubs Stats and Twitter @BradleyWoodrum
Woody, what are the things DanJo does?
walks, HR, K and FB—all indicators of a below league average BABIP—not an indicator of a bad player
In his MLB career he hasn’t had a BABIP above 275
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A low BABIP
Makes it difficult for Maddon to put the hit and run play on with DanJo batting. Kotchman has the advantage in this regard,with his ability to hit ground balls at a vacated position player covering for a steal.The hit and run is a big weapon Joe frequently uses.
This is a true statement, but does not define who is the better player.
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Does Maddon use the hit and run all that much?
I know we steal a lot, but I can’t think of too many times where we’ve hit and run. Maybe I’m just not noticing.
A DRaysBay writer from Cubs Stats and Twitter @BradleyWoodrum
He likes to use it but has been restricted by low contact rate hitters.
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Also Actually I'm wrong
The low BABIP does not drive hit and run ability, contact rate does.
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Career Contact%:
Kotch: 88.2%
Johnson: 84.2%
HUGE gap (no, not really).
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Batted ball type too
CK is a H&R specialist, if it wasn’t for his glove that might be his position listed on B-R
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Serious question: Do we know that Kotchman isn't a dead pull hitter? I haven't checked
But if he pulls more often than not, then why do we suddenly think he’s a good H&R hitter? The 2B isn’t covering the base on those plays, it’ll be putout city.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Career #s
Pulled 30%
Up the Middle 58%
Oppo 17%
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions
No just a quick bref scan
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Because, wouldn't a guy who hits grounders the other way be better in H&R situations?
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions
MLB LHB average BABIP on balls up the middle was around .273
Kotch is around .236. I assume most of those are grounders. What does that say to us?
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
So he'd be hitting a GB right to the SS moving over to cover 2B on the steal? That doesn't seem smart in my mind
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by Sandy Kazmir on Mar 25, 2011 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, seems like GIDP bait depending on where he hits it.
You want someone who hits the ball the other way for H&R and usually a RH so the runner can go first-to-third. Besides, should Kotch ever make the team, he’s going to bat in the lower third. I guess he could bat behind B.J. or Zobrist, but those guys can just steal the bag anyways.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Productive Outs
Kotchman Career 43%
MLB Avg 33%
To be fair DanJo is also 43%.
A hit would count as a success BTW, so you don’t have to make an out
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Career BABIP
Kotch: .268
Johnson: .250
Oh yeah, totally makes up for the 20-point gap in wOBA (totally does not).
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Also, runners on base have to squint because of the gigantic fucking halo around Kotchman's head, I would think this would be a minus in your system
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by Sandy Kazmir on Mar 25, 2011 9:39 AM EDT up reply actions
And no, it doesn't.
BABIP is just average on balls in play. That doesn’t mean it’s harder to do a hit and run or anything. This is ridiculous.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh noes, I don't think you know what BABIP is
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by Sandy Kazmir on Mar 25, 2011 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Is there an easily accessible record of Niemann's 2010 ST stats?
As nice as he’s been this year, I was way more impressed last season.
And I’m super excited about Manny and Damon!
GO RAYS!
I'm not sure about 2010 stats.
It’s hard enough to find 2011.
A DRaysBay writer from Cubs Stats and Twitter @BradleyWoodrum
yeah, I figured.
I just remember thinking that he was beasting and his K/BB ratio was what I liked the most. But I could be misremembering…
GO RAYS!
by SandalsNoPants on Mar 25, 2011 8:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Niemann 2010
3-0, 2.49 ERA
25.1 IP, 26 hits, 7 ER, 3 HR, 3 BB, 24 K’s 29 Groundball outs, 22 flyouts, 2 GIDP
by Jason Collette on Mar 25, 2011 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions
yahoo sports
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/teams/tam/schedule?view=calendar&season=2010
I’m off to work, but I’ll crunch the numbers on Niemann tonight if it isn’t done, no big. It’s more for me, anyway.
GO RAYS!
This has Niemann's numbers from 2010
I was going to revisit this in a post and still may.
http://www.draysbay.com/2010/4/18/1419149/closing-the-door-on-the-spring-of
And here are three yr aggregate spring #s from 2008-2010
http://www.draysbay.com/2010/3/18/1377873/three-year-aggregate-spring
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I would love to agree with you about Zobrist
if I could find his stats…is he up there and I’m just not seeing him?
You are probably the worst user here. I can't believe we let this jackass join the league. The chip on your shoulder is bigger than that micropenis you’re packin’.
by raysfaninminnesota on Mar 25, 2011 9:05 AM EDT reply actions
wouldn't have been the first time i didn't see something right there, so I thought I'd double check
You are probably the worst user here. I can't believe we let this jackass join the league. The chip on your shoulder is bigger than that micropenis you’re packin’.
by raysfaninminnesota on Mar 25, 2011 9:10 AM EDT up reply actions
SPT's Topkin mentioned something about Shoppach hitting lefties very well this spring
but didn’t give any stats. Do you have any idea what his numbers are vs LHP this spring?
You are probably the worst user here. I can't believe we let this jackass join the league. The chip on your shoulder is bigger than that micropenis you’re packin’.
by raysfaninminnesota on Mar 25, 2011 9:09 AM EDT reply actions
I certainly hope that Joey Madds isn't using any of these numbers to make a decision
First of all, it’s hard to miss the BABIPs in the first baseman battle. Johnson, despite slugging .543, has an unluckily low BABIP, while Kotchman’s BABIP looks pretty fortunate. This maybe played into Maddon’s calculus when he proclaimed Johnson the early leader.
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Agreed.
The only guy who should win a job based on spring is Cruz and that’s all about health.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 9:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Jose Lobaton, did you see that homer that one time
Jaso needs to nut up and get out there
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by Sandy Kazmir on Mar 25, 2011 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I bet Lobaton can lay down a mean squeeze bunt.
Who cares that he’s the inferior player, he’d come in super handy once every 20 or so games.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions
In all seriousness, his defense is allegedly superb, no?
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by Sandy Kazmir on Mar 25, 2011 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions
He was the Padres organizational defensive catcher of the year before coming here and getting trounced by Nevin
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Pun intended?
I love Casey Fossum. Now try and take me seriously.
by Steve Slowinski on Mar 25, 2011 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I do think there were more positions where Spring mattered
Not stat lines necessarily, but a lot of these guys were new to the org particularly in the pen.
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
As i point out above DanJo has always been below league average (MLN) in BABIP
and i agree it should not play into who wins the 1B job, of which i’m clearly in support of DanJo
follow me on twitter @sternfan10
Still higher than Kotchman's career OBP.
by R.J. Anderson on Mar 25, 2011 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions
RJ--let me make this as clear as possible
I want DanJo as our first baseman, no if ands or buts
I have no problem with sending Kotchman to Durham and allowing him the opportunity to resurrect his career—no risk in that
follow me on twitter @sternfan10
HaHa, he's angry therefore confusing your point with landlords position
He’s on tilt.
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
You keep throwing that word around and your boy FZ is going to start laying into you
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by Sandy Kazmir on Mar 25, 2011 9:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Nope SF1 is correctly indentifying that BABIP is a skill
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
It appears as if Joyce will get more AB v KHP than SeanRod will v RH and this i can't explain
Joyce has had a bad spring no matter who’s been on the mound
I have to agree with SeanRod that he’ll never consistently hit RHP if his play v them is limited
There is nothing in his minor league career to suggest he can’t hit RHP
follow me on twitter @sternfan10
The thing about the minor leagues is that they're full of minor league players
It’s weird, but try to wrap your mind around it a bit. I hope you aren’t basing regular season decisions on what’s going on in ST, there’s a million reasons or no reasons why certain things are done right now
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by Sandy Kazmir on Mar 25, 2011 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions
Im a big fan of both
Been aboard the hype trains since both were acquired, but Joyce is the better overall hitter. Not to say Rodriguez isn’t good or won’t be above-average hitter, but right now Joyce has better discipline and I’d lean toward Joyce for raw power.
And him having a bad spring is as important as Luis Valbuena or whatever having like 5 home runs this March.
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by Tommy Rancel on Mar 25, 2011 10:10 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I too can not explain why Joyce would face more KHP than SRod vs RHP
Dumbfounded
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Nice spring for Jaso--the hardest sounding hit he had was the baseball banging off his balls
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by sternfan1 on Mar 25, 2011 10:00 AM EDT reply actions 4 recs
You mean Jaso the guy with more home runs this spring than Kotchman? ok.
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by Tommy Rancel on Mar 25, 2011 10:11 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Tommy, the only two guys bringing attention to
Kotchman are you and RJ
Maddon and Friedman and the rest of us clearly get the fact of why he’s in camp
As for Jaso, he is an over rated back up catcher at best, and as i’ve been told many times HR aren’t the end all
Hope you’re feeling better
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lol, Kotchman has everyone on tilt
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
it's getting weird--unless i'm missing something
these two guys and i like both of them have latched on to something and become obsessed with stirring controversy where there clearly isn’t any, at least from those in the know, unless RJ considers the sports blob as a threat to him
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Here is the litmus test:
This is from the watchingdurhambullsbaseball.com blog which I enjoy reading, but this caused a chuckle. Bold emphasis is mine:
And let me say this just to get ahead of the commenters: Yeah, Chris Richard is probably just as good a glove and probably a better bat than Kotchman
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
speaking of Gross, i'm not sure he was a better fit for us in '08 than DanJo might have been
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Where would you have put him?
Floyd was DH and solid.
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
that's the only problem with DanJo--i guess RF but he'd need to mash
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Gross in a platoon is more effective
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
If I recall he played in 80 games
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by FreeZorilla on Mar 25, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Gross--another RJ lovefest struggles and fails
to hang on with the punchless Ms
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Here's to hoping T-Bex can parlay this spring into a strong season in the minors
If he shows that kind of improvement as a hitter this year, the catcalls of being a bust will calm down very quickly.
Happy in a way that Elliot Johnson has won a spot again – it’s hard not to root for the guy – but I do wish there was a better alternative there. Plus, he’s always started fast and tapered off.
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Felipe Lopez if he hits well at Durham
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by Imperialism32 on Mar 25, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
LOL at Kyle Farnsworth's FIP
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