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Stadium Proposal Part 3: Funding Solutions

This is a collaborative effort by the writing team. This is the third of a three-part series on this topic. Part one addressed the location, part two addressed the facility, and part three will address possible funding avenues that have been utilized in other cities.

Up until now, it is all been fun and games while we have looked location and stadium ideas but in the end, these ideas have a price tag. Given the fact that in the past sixty years, just two baseball stadium have been 100 percent financed with private funds (Dodger Stadium and AT&T Park), it is safe to assume that if a new facility for the Rays is to happen, public dollars are going to have to be involved.

Just the mention of public dollars going toward multi-millionaire and billionaire's teams creates angst quicker that David Price's fastball gets to home plate. Field of Schemes by Neil deMause speaks to that angst and the weblog that allows the book to take on a new form as it continually documents this issue across all major sports and with rather impassioned commentary.

Star-divide

I really can't imagine why Sternberg thinks this is a wise strategy. With the Bucs' home sitting vacant across the bay due to the same greedy squabbles, myself and most of the people in this area are sick and tired of hearing more of this non-drama that only translates into more theft from the public. The Rays can stay or go - I could care less at this point. And I'm most likely never going to attend a game even with free tickets, since any concession or parking I pay supports those greedy pricks.

If we swapped out the topic with any other occupation than pro sports, we'd be laughing at these greedy deluded idiots. Extreme Frisbee, star trek fan geeks, yoga enthusiasts - everyone would understand what an absurd argument is being made to preserve the slim class of fanboys who value watching a game over money or free time.

Unfortunately I don't think the rest of the sporting public is going to learn their lesson. Instead of learning from the strikes/threats they'll go right back to sitting around and paying insane prices to watch mediocre talent.

That is one view of the current situation on a reputable national site, but the tone from the local communities is quite similar. Consider some of the comments from a recent story from TampaBay.com related to Tampa Mayor Bob Buckhorn throwing out a ceremonial first pitch during the series against the Reds:

oh please tell me this moron isnt going to want to spend millions of tax dollars on a baseball team,, theres only so many peices of pie, or in other words expendable dollars for citezens to spend on games of any type,, HELLO bad economy high ticket prices, 10.00 beers, what are you thinking,,

***

What makes you think that people will not drive to St Pete, but they will fight the rush hour traffic to get to downtown Tampa. I love the rays, but if they think the problem will be soved with a new stadium let them pay for it.

***

Jesus Christ this team is only 13 years old!!! The Rays ownership expects the attendence of an 80+ year old franchise in 13 years? The only idiots are the folks that buy into Stu's argument that the Trop is the problem....fan bases take several generations to build, regardless of their record on the field. You are being played like a violin.

***

Bob is exactly right, all this is about is padding league owners' pockets at taxpayer expense. What Stu wants is what the Selig family got from the taxpayers of southeastern Wisconsin... a new venue that doubles the market value of the franchise, which is then sold. This is just a siphon of taxpayer money to the owners.

***

Bingo... regardless of where the best location for the stadium is, it's still corporate welfare. if we can't afford to pay teachers a decent wage, or afford to build a proper regional expressway network or public transit, then we sure as heck can't afford to give 8 figure annual handouts to billionaires. They're wealthy beyond imagination, let them build their own stadium. and if they can't figure out how to pay for it, sell the team to an owner who can.

***

Many of you are absolutely right. A new stadium would end up being corporate welfare. But what you don't get is that this corporate welfare is necessary because TAMPA BAY IS A BAD INVESTMENT FOR BASEBALL. Fans don't pay anywhere near enough to support even an average-priced major league baseball team, even with a big welfare check from the rest of baseball. It's questionable whether that's possible with a new stadium mostly paid for by the taxpayer while the Rays get most of the benefits. That's how bad the financial situation is with the Rays. But if you want a free-market solution, there's only one solution, the Rays leave. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying.

Locations can be found, builders can be contracted, but dirt cannot be moved without funding and the comments above, while coming across as a bit extreme, represent the vocal majority in print and electronic media in this market. A bigger roadblock to attitude in the market would be the glaring spotlight on any stadium funding in the area after the suspicious ways the Marlins got funding before it was learned how much profit they were making each year and potentially none of this can happen without a public vote if a measure is passed requiring any expenditures over $100M in St. Petersburg be put to a public referendum.

In any stadium funding discussion, the trenches will be dug in WWI fashion between the public and private financing armies and the discussions between the two parties often resemble the stalemate battles that comprised most of that war. The public financing side would point to studies showing how much of an economic impact sports teams have on an area while the private financing crowd will hold up similar studies debunking those numbers in one hand and balance sheets with red ink in the other hand.

Residents saw this story play out somewhat in 2009 with mayoral candidate Larry Williams who quoted a study that stated the Tampa Bay Rays had an economic impact of $298M in 2008 while opponents such as the St. Petersburg Chamber of Commerce commissioned a study that found the Rays' economic impact to be $200M less in that same year. Further, a commissioned study for the initial new stadium proposal found an economic impact anywhere from $137M to $213M a year as yet another broad range that points to the inexact data in measuring a new stadium's impact.

At best, studying the economic impact of a sports team is an inaccurate if not biased science but at some point, parties must agree on a number because the amount of public financing on any project is directly tied to how scared the market is of the team taking that impact and those jobs to another market.

Since 1991, 21 different baseball stadiums have open in the United States, excluding Turner Field given its unique status as an Olympics-funded effort. Each of them were funded in a different way from the completely publicly-funded U.S. Cellular Field to the completely privately-financed AT&T Park. The table below shows how the money broke down for each of the stadiums.

Newtable_medium

*thanks for the correction, Cardinals nation*

In all, 54 percent of the funding for these projects came from public financing while 46 percent came from private sources. Those figures are influenced heavily by the massive cost to the new Yankee Stadium and its private funding bill as well as the entirely privately-funded AT&T park. If we remove those two projects from this group, nearly two-thirds of the dollars spent on stadium construction have come from public funds with just over one-third coming from private sources. 

The chart below shows the parks in chronological order as well as by breakdown of public and private funding:

Newgraph_medium

Petco Park and Citizens Bank Pallpark represent the best examples of financial compromise of the stadiums with the first two and last stadiums on the chart represent the worst as the ownership groups of those three teams, one of which was Major League Baseball itself, spent a total of $24.4M toward the final bill. You might recall that the original new stadium proposal on the site of Al Lang Field was for $450M with Rays' ownership paying one-third of that costs plus taking on the responsibility for cost overruns which would put that old proposal right in line with the current 67/33 split that we see after taking out Yankee Stadium and AT&T Park.

In this current economic client, it would be a near-impossible sell to the public to ask them to foot 67 percent of the costs of a new stadium on the heels of cuts in education and an unemployment rate for the bay area that is still above the national average. That said, these other cities utilized many different funding streams to find the dollars necessary to build these stadiums anywhere from naming rights to tax increases. Examples include:

  • Phoenix: Implemented a quarter-cent increase in the county sales tax and allowed the Diamondbacks organization to keep all baseball revenue as well as a percentage of non-baseball event revenue. 
  • Detroit: Sold naming rights for 30 years as well as taxed all rental car agreements two percent and hotel stays one percent. Additionally, revenue from Indian Casinos was utilized.
  • St. Louis: Long-term loan from St. Louis County was used as well as private bond sales, tax breaks, and bank loans.
  • Denver: Increased the local sales tax 0.1 percent in six of the Denver-area counties.
  • Cincinnati: Voters approved a half-cent sales tax increase to fund both a new baseball and a new football stadium and sold the naming rights to the baseball stadium for $45M.
  • Milwaukee: Passed a tax increase to five Milwaukee-area counties.
  • Houston: Taxed hotel stays and rental cars and received a $33M no-interest loan from local business leaders.
  • San Diego: Received $21M from the Port of San Diego and another $76M from the Centre City Development Corporation.
  • Pittsburgh: Implemented a county hotel tax, a surcharge on Pirates and Steelers tickets while both were still at Three Rivers Stadium, as well as a one percent performance tax on all visiting players that did not live in Pittsburgh.
  • Cleveland: Imposed a 15-year sin tax on cigarettes and alcohol within Cuyahoga County.
  • Seattle: Imposed a food tax and rental car tax in King County to foot $340M of the bill.
  • New York: Pulled money from parking facility revenues
  • Minneapolis: Passed a 0.15 percent sales tax increase in Hennepin County.
  • Arlington: Passed a 0.5 cent sales tax for a period of 12-15 years.
  • Miami: Imposed taxes on tourists on rental cars and hotels.
As it stands now, we have an owner who has said he is willing to pay $150M and cost overruns as part of an old proposal and wants the ability to explore sites in the entire Tampa Bay area and a mayor who said he is open to discuss the Rays moving within Pinellas County but nowhere else. That is where the trenches where dug in 2008 and that is essentially where they stay today. As WTSP's Noah Pransky pointed out yesterday, what current mayor Bob Buckhorn said about the Rays' stadium situation is essentially what current St. Petersburg mayor Bill Foster said before he was elected with the two disagreeing on where that new home should be built.

The good news is that business leaders from both sides of the bay are finally coming to the table to discuss the economic impact of the Rays as well as possible sources of public and private funding. Additionally, Hillsborough County is kicking around some ideas to help generate funding for a new stadium that would also help encourage private investment into the project and we hope that they are able to find creative ways to generate funding revenues as other cities have done. Stuart Sternberg's wealth is not easily discovered but given the shady experience in Miami, a doubting public may be more willing to participate in the process should the Rays open up their books. We know from leaked reports in 2010 the Rays are not exactly hiding profit and the 2008 post-season run is what saved them from being in a less-fortunate situation as they are today. 

If a new stadium is to happen in downtown Tampa, it will take the communities in the area working together for the common good of the area. The St. Pete Times had a wonderful timeline back in 2010 that outlined what type of schedule needed to happen as well as how the financials in the discussion changed the longer this process was delayed. We highly recommend you click on the link for the full explanation of the process but a peek at the timeline itself shows you where this process is now and why it is time for action. 

Timeline_medium

Enough bickering, enough postering, enough silence. If baseball has a viable and successful long-term future in the Tampa Bay area, a new facility is a necessity. One that will help generate the type of public and corporate support that has allowed other markets to shed their small-market labels and lessen the margin of error those clubs had to tolerate as they were hamstrung by limited revenue streams against aging stadiums that grew more out-dated season after season. Other markets have provided examples of creative public and private funding sources and now it is up to our local leadership to find the best mix of those examples as well as any new ideas they discover to find the magic recipe for a new solution. 

Our goal in proposing a location for a new stadium, a model for a new stadium, and presenting funding  histories for other stadiums was to generate discussion and interest to fill the void left by both team ownership and city leadership that seem to comment once or twice a season on the matter with little compromise between the two parties. It is our hope that this information can reinvigorate the local discussion on what is a third-rail topic and to better inform interested fans as they engage their local politicians as well as participate in the public part of the process. 

---

Data for these figured pulled from sources such as Wikipedia, ballparks.com, ballparksofbaseball.com, and shadowofthestadium.blogspot.com.

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The mayor of St. Pete has a legitimate objection

The Trop is the economic center of the city. That’s what makes the city. You take that out, and you have Flint, Michigan with a pier. I know that, as Rays fans, we want what’s best for the team. But I can definitely see where Bill Foster is coming from.

14/f/cali

by acablue on Jul 1, 2011 7:41 AM EDT reply actions  

But no credibility

EVERYONE said when Stu took over, give us a winner and we will come. That hasn’t happened. Now the excuses are changing. And if it is so vital to the city, then they should be a little more willing to make something happen. Stu’s not going to hand over nearly 200 million dollars to build a park that no one will go to.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 9:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Huh?

I don’t see how what this unsourced ‘everyone’ has to do with Foster’s credibility. Are you saying Foster, not even mayor at the time, bears some sort of personal responsibility for the lack of attendance at Rays games from 2005-present? That makes no sense, and undermines your credibility.

by GomesSweetGomes on Jul 1, 2011 9:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

I didn't word this right

What I meant to say is that you can’t say something is vital without supporting it. How is it vital to area if no one shows?

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ok, that makes sense

I don’t agree with the initial post in its chicken-little tone. I think foster has a legitimate objection in that notwithstanding the poor attendance, the trop generates business for the residents of the city. Additionally, the city has a direct, tangible monetary interest in enforcing the lease. If he just let them go for free, it would be essentially an 80 million plus handout. And doing so would be ridiculously stupid of him, as his job is not to protect the interests of Tampa Bay or the Rays, but rather the City of St. Petersburg and its financial interests.

by GomesSweetGomes on Jul 1, 2011 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who is saying let them walk out scott free?

There’s a cost for everything. And the area needs to decide what side of the cost they want to be on. No, there will be no new stadium, and you will have to find it elsewhere and pay to get out of your lease. Or, yes, there will be a new stadium and work to find common ground. Right now it’s do it our way or we are taking our ball and going home. If they just want money to buy-out lease and use funds elsewhere, that’s totally fine and understandable. But if you are going to do it that way, the Rays should be allowed to talk to other venues.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Time for area to accept facts without bitching

No one HAS to go to games. Fact. St. Pete does not HAVE to support baseball. Fact. But NO business owner keeps a business that is LOSING money, or can’t sustain what they are doing. The Rays are on borrowed time. If you really stop and think about it, it’s incredible the Rays have even had the success they’ve had. The only reason why they keep that success is through drafting prowess and making critical trades.

Public funds for any area that wants a baseball team take up 66% of the cost. Fact. Having a baseball team is a luxury not a necessity. Fact. But it’s a luxury that also generates revenue for the area and provides jobs. Fact. It’s time for the area to decide if this is a luxury they want or not. And stop bitching at an owner who has been the best owner in the area and wants to make money just like anyone else.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 9:07 AM EDT reply actions  

He doesn't have to keep the business, and if he wants to force his way to Tampa or out of the area that's fine, but don't give me that bullshit that he's losing money

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

Fact. But NO business owner keeps a business that is LOSING money, or can’t sustain what they are doing

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

But I'm not replying to Stu, I'm replying to noted person with local stake in the issue raysfaninminnesota

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

I was a FL resident for most of my life

I’m not some out-of-stater, snowbird that has no clue. And I’m not saying most people on this site bitch about him. It’s the ridiculous heater crap and average person who has no concept of baseball as a business. This area is not guaranteed a team. Just like any other business, if it is not earning income, it will move somewhere that can support it. That’s just basic economics, isn’t it?

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

So it's either going to Hillsborough with no funding or they're going to move out of state? Ok

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

I didn't say that, did I?

There’s really not much for debate when it comes to financial.

1. Either it’s completely privatized (not likely)
2. Or it’s mutually funded since it’s mutually benefitting – with the debate being how much each side pays…and then how to pay for it with public funding.
3. Or the team moves to an area that is willing to pay for part of the funds.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think that 2 is going to be the most likely option anywhere, and my point is that Pinellas is the area I think can do it. I don't see Hills having the loot

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm not disagreeing with what you are saying

but based on what I’ve seen, Hills has shown more willingness to work with the Rays than Pinellas has. And if they were so willing to help, why did people get all up in arms about the Rays proposal for a stadium a few years ago? Where was the support then?

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hillsborough officials seem to have more willingness to work with the Rays because they don't have an existing asset to protect like St. Pete does.

I guarantee you, people will get up in arms about any stadium proposal given the economy and the appearance of corporate welfare. If you think people were rabidly opposed to it pre-TARP with the sail stadium, it will be even worse now.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

Were the people rabidly opposed to HSR or was it just the political leaders?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

Or leader, rather.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

People weren't opposed to the HSR that the feds were offering.

Since it was perceived as free money. Light rail is a different story.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

It did pass within the downtown area.

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

All I'm saying is, I don't think the transit tax is a good example for tax initiatives

in Hillsborough County. It was poorly put together and passed in urban areas.

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think it's a pretty good gauge of broad public appetite.

They devoted a lot of effort to trying to woo rural and suburban voters with flex bus routes and neighborhood circulators, as well as road improvements. They failed terribly.

If you want to look at the CIT tax that funded RayJay, that passed like 52-48 in flush economic times, and they had to include bribes for stuff like library and police funding to get it over the top. Not to mention that the election date it was held on coincided with a huge Democratic primary in Hillsborough to replace Sam Gibbons in Congress, therefore driving liberal voters to the polls.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Get on gchat right quick, need to see about 4th plans

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

"Are you getting the watermelon? I can't talk about it here, because then Sandy will win."

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

Some of us don't like to blab our plans all over a website like you and bowey do

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

Get on AOL real quick...

that thing we were talking about? It’s happening.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

But you're not on AIM??????????

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oh...

I was kidding.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

That thing I dm'd you about the other day seems to have resolved itself without intervention

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

The AC concern?

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

NO REAL CONCERNS

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'd recommend that everyone get two

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Losing money- actually not covering costs - is the worst case scenerio

Team gets into NY bankruptcy court

Goes bankrupt

Stu becomes debtor in possession (hey, McCourt can do this) with financing from MLB

Gets the bankruptcy court to cancel the Trop lease

Moves the team to Tampa as part of a plan of bankruptcy

by BudGHG on Jul 1, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oops.

that was a pretty dumb post.

What I was trying to get at is I don’t think the team can be in that bad of a financial spot since I keep reading that the lease is solid, the possibility of injunctions to keep them from talking to Tampa, etc.

But that is still reading too much into things.

by BudGHG on Jul 1, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

That's great if that's a way to fund a stadium in tampa, mozel tov.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

haha

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

Foster won't let Stu talk to the New York bankruptcy judge?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

No, to Tampa

They can never explore funding until they can actually talk

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

Did you read the post that this is all in response to?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

Why not let them talk as long as they understand that concessions to St. Pete must be taken into consideration

Maybe they will realized that funding isn’t going to work and a toytown location then becomes the focus.

Then Tampa won’t be able to bitch because they had their chance.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

The problem is him viewing St. Pete as an island

like moving to Tampa is the same as moving to Portland.

What’s best for the area might not be what is best for St. Pete

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Pinellas County and St. Pete taxes directed towards the Trop have probably totaled $200 million.

He has a responsibility to protect his investment, and drive the best bargain he can for taxpayers. No one else.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm a St. Pete resident.

He won’t be getting my vote if he can’t find a solution that keeps them in the area.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

No offense to you.

But he doesn’t give a shit, because that’s not what the vast majority of his constituents prioritize.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

I disagree

If he loses the Rays he will never get reelected and be one of the most hated men in the area

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fine.

Still means that the team will have spent 20 years in the Trop, at least, by the time it moves elsewhere. The building will be 30 years old by then too. The city will have gotten its value.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

This is ridiculously dumb

A New York Court doesn’t have jurisdiction over land deals made in Florida. Read your constitution and try again.

by GomesSweetGomes on Jul 1, 2011 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Anyone have any clue as to the damage Naimoli has done with local businesses and the ramifications of getting those businesses involved?

Hooters central Hub is located in Clearwater (at least the original restaurant anyway). Why has it taken this long to get some sort of bigger partnership with them? This is more of what the Rays need, instead of fans. Isn’t the old adage that corporate sponsors account for nearly 2/3 of all season tix? New TV deal, New stadium naming rights deal, more corporate sponsors and the Rays will inch closer to avg attendance and long-term financial viability.

Despite the stadium debate, this team is in line for a bigger economic boon to boost payroll up to respectable levels soon. Add in a new stadium, and that 70 mil payroll in 2010 isn’t an anomaly.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 9:20 AM EDT reply actions  

Hooters was in Atlanta...

and I think is now out of Japan or something

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

What about Hooters air?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, on Hampton, though that place gets emptier every time I drive by

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't believe that is the Hooters corporate...

it’s actually the Original 6 company, that is a franchisee.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Here's all of your ideas in graphic form

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Someday you'll be an adult and these responses won't fly

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, that's what I do

Don’t mention that I’ve backed up Collette throughout this entire piece even if I don’t agree with everything he’s said.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

Writers and buttbuddies aren't the same

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

It sucks that when I disagree with someone I vocalize that instead of stepping in line, I'm also generally the first to back someone up when I agree with them

It’s about the ideas, not the people.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

Translation:

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

Wow, you're spewing garbage about shit you don't know about.

Because you haven’t lived in this area and don’t understand its politics or history. Valuable contribution!

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

In all fairness he does have a business background

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

Two, obvi

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

In all fairness he does have a vagrancy background

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Good one

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

Have any other local issues you want to give your opinion on then?

Maybe the homeless issue in St. Pete? Cause after all, if Billy Foster catches you sleeping on the street again you’ll be rounded up and sent to Pinellas Hope.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

I covered that, move them to the Astro's ST facility that is abandoned 10 months out of the year, let them play ball year round like it was Field of Dreams

The homeless are the next untapped market inefficiency. I’ve passed out on plenty of streets but never in Tampa, so you got me there.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

thanks a lot, asshole

I forgot I wasn’t on mute on a call and busted out laughing at this comment right in the middle of someone giving an update on her project. Uncomfortable….

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Would you rather he post from his DaPriceIsRight account?

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because he bitched to me on GChat.

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

They have the right to Illinois and Florida, I believe...

maybe some international locales too.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

a proposal I would back, if the politicians would look past the border issues...

…is a joint-funding project between Hillsborough and Pinellas counties that would cover the public funding costs of a new baseball stadium AS WELL AS public funding for a bi-county light rail system. Connecting major locations like USF, the gulf beaches, downtown Tampa, downtown St. Pete, downtown New Port Richey, downtown Bradenton, Raymond James, Raymond James Stadium, airports to boat ports.

We could then have an alternative route to sporting events like at the baseball game where we don’t have to pay an extra $20 for parking. The light rail would improve the Tampa Bay’s marketing towards national sporting events like the Final Four (where the biggest complaint people had about our hosting it was the poor traffic)… and possibly a chance at selling our area for a Summer Olympics down the road.

We funded the Ray Jay stadium through a penny tax that was shared with building more schools in the county, right? We could do the same with the new Rays stadium: a penny tax shared between the baseball stadium (regardless of if they stay in Pinellas at Feather Sound or if they move to downtown Tampa on the riverside) and the Tampa Bay metro light rail. If the rail plans go into Pasco and Manatee counties, they get included in the tax deal as well.

Can that work?

Time to shamelessly plug my book and short story!

by witty on Jul 1, 2011 9:42 AM EDT reply actions  

Shut up

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

What the fuck does this have to do with anything? Yes I think that's realistic

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would say the shared-penny tax for a stadium is not plausible

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

What about some of the other ideas used?

Performance tax on the athletes coming in (not like they can choose not to come here), sin tax for this area of heathens, etc?

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

The point is that there is no way a regional tax will work. Pinellas residents won't pay one for a stadium in Hills and Hills residents won't pay one for a stadium in Pinellas

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

"People have no problem with sin taxes" What?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

Cigarette smokers are a minority with no public voice

You know this

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm no longer a smoker so I spit at you filth, yes. But the area already has sin taxes out Hatfields butthole, they're going to add more?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

Legalize and regulate other smokeable substance.

/pisses off pot smokers everywhere

Twitter: @mbleazy

by MikeB. on Jul 1, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Jeb got rid of the sin tax on alcohol in 2006

What other local sin taxes are in place for the area? (curious)

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sin taxes are regulated by the Legislature.

I don’t think the Legislature is going to hike sin taxes or authorize a sin tax hike to fund a local stadium project, especially considering they hiked the cigarette tax two years ago by a pretty substantial margin.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

Localities can't impose additional taxes on that?

Guessing a state constitution difference between OH and FL?

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

Remember, this is a rabidly anti-tax state.

And our functioning Constitution was passed in 1968, so it’s a relatively modern framework that has closed a lot of loopholes for local municipalities to hike taxes.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

So that whole self-governing mantra only goes down so far.

Can’t let the common people have too much power.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Well, yeah.

This is a Legislature that will scream about local control when the Feds try to do something like enforce nutrient pollution standards in waterways, but then pass a bill in the same breath banning municipalities from restricting fertilizer sales in the summer.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

They're going to follow the path of least resistance

Just like water, electricity, and my sperm

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

A dude's butt is the path of least resistance?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

FAAAAAAART

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

You just got TGN1'd, deal with it

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but what do I do with this bloody knife?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Just put it back in your back where I left it, carpetbagger

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

You missed all vital organs and just nicked my liver which is fucked anyway, nice try

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Someone has to stop you thugs

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

I pay sin taxes out the butthole.

Never hindered me from buying my goodies.

@RealNolenBailey

by Hatfield on Jul 1, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

The alternative is to quit smoking and drinking, and frankly, most of us would die if we did those things

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would die if I did those things.

Will it shed years off my life and make me poorer?

Yes. The shitty years.

@RealNolenBailey

by Hatfield on Jul 1, 2011 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

I tried to look up sales figures for cigs and booze but wasn't able to find any

I wanted to slap something together that showed what a 10 cent sin tax over 15 years plus a $5 per player per game tax on all performers (football, baseball, hockey, soccer, et) would generate funding wise.

US spent 90B on tobacco products in 2006 and roughly 130B on booze that year.

In 2006, the US population was roughly 300M while the bay area was 4m or .013% of the population. If we assume that everyone spent money on tobacco products at the same rate, we get 11.7M in tales to the area in 2006.

A 10 cent tax on those sales generates 1.17M a year
A 20 cent tax on those sales generates 2.34M a year
A 25 cent tax on those sales generates 2.93M a year

For alcohol, it breaks down as:

A 10 cent tax on those sales generates 1.69M a year
A 20 cent tax on those sales generates 3.38M a year
A 25 cent tax on those sales generates 4.23M a year

These are loose numbers but a 25 cent sin tax on those would kick up 7.2M a year

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Whoa whoa whoa the soccer players only make $5 a game. Think of their children.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

That's my fault

I didn’t mean to put soccer players as performers. That should come under a boring tax. My bad

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Their many many children

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

and if they continue that attitude, both lose when the team leaves

Which I still think is 50% likely to happen.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think it is more likely than some here think

but I wouldn’t go 50-50.

If Stu can get a sweetheart deal in another city even if it isn’t as good of a market as here I think he would go for it if prospects of a new stadium get bogged down here

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Then that's what's going to happen. I know you guys aren't familiar with the Bay Area but that's how things are here and how they have been for the last 69 years.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

And there will be 420 people holding a "save our Rays" rally in 5 years

because the Hillboroughs and the McCoy’s couldn’t work together.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, it's those Pinellas rascals that won't play ball with the reasonable Tampians

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think you understand.

This area had two separate bids in for a hockey team in 1990, as in both Tampa and St. Petersburg submitted different expansion bids. Tampa got the team, but they two counties didn’t collaborate on even getting a team and the Lightning still came.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

...all over the place

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

So they ran the risk of neither getting a team by refusing to work together?

Luckily it worked out but if they would have lost out to say, Memphis, because they wouldn’t pool their resources together, they dumb.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes it's dumb, but that's how it is here and any plan has to factor that in

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

I made it clear that there has to be cooperation here and it can't be just Hillsborough

Pinellas is going to have to be compensated for the loss and involved in revenue streams moving forward

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

What you're not acknowledging here is that Pinellas not only has the leverage, but also can get it funded.

Hillsborough brings nothing to the table except for population

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

how can they get it funded?

And are they willing to? They sure were not willing to with the last attempt, and they for damn sure don’t even want to talk about it. Pinellas only has leverage for so long.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

They can extend existing revenue bonds and tap a variety of tourist taxes.

As well as use the Trop’s land to put forward more money.

What you’re missing is: Voters don’t want to fund a new stadium, anywhere. At least not right now, and probably not in the next five years. It’s an impossible sale. The team was going up against that in 2008, and will even moreso now.

Also, you’re confused on the facts. Foster has said that he’s willing to talk about Pinellas locations. It’s the team that has chosen not to take him up on that. Pinellas may have leverage for only so long, but the longer this process goes on the longer the team will have stayed in the Trop and the more the city can say that their investment in that asset provided value.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

I've already pointed that out elsewhere in this thread, I'm not going to find it for you again

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

I hope you are right

but when there is no willingness to do it, it doesn’t matter what options you can use, because no one is willing to consider them. And the longer this delays and goes on, the more the Rays can be willing to consider if Tampa or anywhere else is a more viable and sustainable spot for a stadium.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

but would the residents of both counties agree to pay for a metro rail system that covers both counties?

I know the recent vote in Hillsborough got shot down, but it was a close vote and it happened during a midterms election where the anti-tax crowd was out in force voting against it. In today’s world of Rick Scott and the GOP screwing public services over, local voters in both counties coping with major traffic issues every day might be more inclined to financially support a penny tax towards a construction project that can hire local workers and provide long-term transit support during harsh economic times.

Or do I have too much faith in local voters…?

Time to shamelessly plug my book and short story!

by witty on Jul 1, 2011 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

No sin tax

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

They're trying to tax your lappers Gilliss

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

I KNOW!

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

_____

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is it the turn of the 19th century? What is everyone's obsession with trains?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

reading too much steampunk

also too many visits to metros like Chicago, DC and New York that have local rail transits and are thus easier to get about than the goddamn traffic.

Time to shamelessly plug my book and short story!

by witty on Jul 1, 2011 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Centralized cities, for the most part with much larger populations on the first and last.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

massive population sprawl for all three cities though

especially DC, which gets a lot of suburban transit from Northern Virginia and the Baltimore-Annapolis-DC triangle.

Time to shamelessly plug my book and short story!

by witty on Jul 1, 2011 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

You're nuts if you think HIllsborough is going to take on a penny tax for a stadium (no matter what else you throw in there to disguise the intent of the bill) after they rejected HALF A CENT for a comprehensive light rail infrastructure.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm sure they'd rather spend double that money on a private stadium

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

What?
As WTSP’s Noah Pransky pointed out yesterday, what current mayor Bob Buckhorn said about the Rays leaving St. Petersburg is essentially what current St. Petersburg mayor Bill Foster said before he was elected.

<blockquoteBut asked whether he thinks the Rays will move to Tampa, Buckhorn said, “No. It’s my belief that at some point the Rays will leave St. Petersburg … and I absolutely want to be ready when that happens.”
>

Bill Foster, Former City Councilman
May ‘09: Says a new stadium is a priority or the team will leave sometime after 2016. Rebuilding on current site is preference, but if the team doesn’t want to stay downtown, he could live with Gateway. Tampa is not an option.
July ’09 : Downtown needs to remain a priority, but if a new stadium is to be built, elsewhere in St. Pete is preferable to losing team to another city.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:48 AM EDT reply actions  

Foster is a dunce because he thinks the stadium should be in downtown where it can spur development? It's great that everyone laughs at his christian values and all, but what exactly is stupid about what he's saying Sveet?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

The team will never in a million years go for a new stadium downtown

Maybe he should be a tad more realistic and we could see some movement on the issue.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

Stu has proven it how?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are you serious on this TGN?

He has put a winning product and still people don’t attend.

The ratings are through the roof. The fans are here. They just don’t attend. Location is a big factor in that.

Look at the stats by compiled by the ABC committee. The Rays have the smallest number of fans by far within a 30 min drive of their stadium.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

1) Have you considered that part of the attendance issue might be the stadium itself? You don't think people will make the trek for a shiny new sail stadium?

2) Yes, fine they have the smallest number of fans within 30 minutes. But when public money goes towards a project like this it isn’t spent with what is best for the private enterprise in mind (or it shouldn’t be), it is spent with the idea of where it would have the best impact. A new stadium in Downtown St Pete probably has a better impact for spurring development.

3) Gateway is probably a better location because it is (1) more regionally accessible, and (2) more fund-able, but it isn’t an area that is going to get much more ancillary development from having a stadium there.

4) As an aside, the location in downtown tampa and the location in gateway are in storm surge areas, whereas downtown st pete isn’t. Not sure if that’s a concern at all (probably not, but never know)

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

The prob is not as much of fans not attending, but corporate sponsorships

Does this area have enough corporations that would kick in with season tix?

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

6 of the top 10 companies in Tampa Bay are in Pinellas

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

Check out the newest St. Pete Slant.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

so 3 of the top 6 that are in Pinellas are sponsoring the team

and moving the stadium 4 miles up 275 is going to bring those other 3 in? If they lose the 3 sponsors by coming over the bay, what is the likelihood they make that up in new Tampa sponsors?

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

So much is said about what Rays attendance doesn't have

But what they do have is weekend attendance. It’s the weekdays that suck. What helps that is season tix. I don’t believe we’d be having as much of an issue with this if TB had 5,000 more season tix.

Maybe I’m completely off base, but I believe the biggest obstacle of the Rays attendance issue is corporate sponsorships.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

Baycare; Times; Rayjay; Tech Data; Jabil; HSN. Not sure how many of those are sponsors, but 4 of those have HQs within walking distance from Toytown

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

Don't believe HSN is a sponsor.

But I could be wrong.
(former employee)

Twitter: @mbleazy

by MikeB. on Jul 1, 2011 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

MIKEB. HERE, ARE YOU SICK OF BROKEN HYMENS RUINING YOUR FURNITURE?

WELL CHECK OUT THIS WONDERFUL NEW PRODUCT FROM THE BOYS THAT BROUGHT YOU OXYCODONE CLEAN. IT’S CHERRYSOFF!

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

HSN isn't a sponsor.

Neither is RayJay. Both would be hard to not woo with a Carillon stadium.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

HSN is doing very well too.

If the stadium moved to their backyard and they didn’t sponsor or buy a large # of season tickets for employees, they are filth.

Twitter: @mbleazy

by MikeB. on Jul 1, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

Carrolwood.

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Carillon

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Er...that's what I meant.

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

What should he say. "As the mayor of St Pete it is in the best interest of this private enterprise that they move to another city, county and tax base. Go ahead, we'll just eat the rest of this lease"

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

What's stopping them from talking to Tampa?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

The lease

They aren’t allowed to discuss a new stadium with anybody

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Uh, that's absurd

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

...
These two sections of St. Petersburg’s contract with the Tampa Bay Rays are why the city thinks it could use an injunction, if need be, to keep the team in town. This third section specifically forbids the Rays from talking to any other city about relocating.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

And that's enforceable how?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

"I SEEN 'EM JUDGE, I SEEN 'EM TALKIN"

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

.
May ’09: Says a new stadium is a priority or the team will leave sometime after 2016.

That’s where they’re in agreement

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

But that's not the important part of what either of them are saying

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

This is bullshit
We know from leaked reports in 2010 the Rays are not exactly hiding profit and the 2008 post-season run is what saved them from being in a less-fortunate situation as they are today.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:49 AM EDT reply actions  

Maury Brown also broke that down and was on radio here several times

Without the post-season run, the picture would be a lot more grim. They’re not exactly banking coin as they’ve done in Pitt and Miami

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

Bull shit. The value of the franchise continues to accrue. YTD revenue is only a small portion.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

We're talking about operating income here not the value of the asset as a whole

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

Why?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

Because if the team doesn't have a positive operating income then it's only a matter of time before the asset devalues

Once it devalues it will fall much faster than the amount of time it took to prop up that value. Nobody would want to buy a team worth $150M that loses between $10 and $20M a year.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

Holy shit that's dumb. The team might not make a ton of money, but it certainly doesn't lose money on a yearly basis. A baseball team is a market with a significant barrier to entry and therefore will continue to accrue value until the sport itself

loses value

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

He paid a ton of money for the franchise.

You don’t buy a big business like that just to make a slim profit margin.

He has a right to make money.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Read before you post Sveet, my point is that HE IS MAKING MONEY

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

By having one of the lowest payrolls in the sport, the margins are so thin that every wrong move could cripple the team for years

They need to be able to spend more money if only even for the flexibility it affords. They can’t do that now because they’re clearing $5M with a $40M payroll.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

1) I seriously think you're wrong on the NOI here. MLB never gives up financials, so when shit like that leaks its for an agenda.

2) They can roll with a low payroll until they get a new stadium or TV contract. It’s what they’re going to do anyway. The way to get this deal done is not to plead poverty. That’s insulting and stupid.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

So let them. I'm not anti-tampa, I'm pro reality

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

You're just an IMBY

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

The entire bay area is my back yard dipswitch, you must not have a geography background

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Bill Foster isn't pro reality if he thinks that DT St. Pete is a viable option

I’m a St. Pete resident too and this is hard for me to say, but I have come to the conclusion that it just won’t work there.

It’s not St. Pete’s fault either.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm glad you took the time to do the soul searching

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

I understand he is making money

but then people shouldn’t be pissed when the payroll is 40 million.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

You're flying around in circles buddy, when did that come up?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

He isn't making much money that was my point

He should be clearing more then a few million a year

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

On the INVESTMENT

not on the budget year to year. That is breaking even or slightly above. The point is, he cannot invest money in team to compete without going in the red. If Andrew Friedman cannot be a miracle worker year in and year out, this team cannnot compete. And then the attendance will go down even further.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

but that's where he got a sweet deal

No matter what, Stu will make a profit on his investment. But he’s not in position to compete at the present time, and annual profit is small, comparatively speaking.

But look at what he’s done to try to improve that so far. 1) Renovate current stadium as much as possible. 2) New complex in Port Charlotte. 3) Establish a small presence in Orlando. 4) Put as much of a winning product on the field as possible.

By doing this he has given himself a regional presence that will help his next TV deal, which will have a huge financial impact, being able to tap into one of the biggest TV markets of St. Pete/Tampa/Orlando. He’s done everything he can to make the Rays competitive. But he needs regional support for the final part, a new stadium. Stats from ABC show problem with current stadium, and stats in this article show the average amount that areas put towards a new stadium.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

The presence in Orlando is so small I can't see it

They haven’t done jack here since 2008 and it annoys me. There is a radio deal with 660 AM to carry games and that’s if you can pick up a signal which is damn near impossible. ESPN radio here in Orlando (who I work for) carries goddamn Braves games on the radio.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

no facility

Braves tied in long-term with Disney, Astros the same in Kissimmee. Tinker Field is the same shithole the Twins abandoned to go to Ft Myers.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

Port Charlotte was shit hole too

Should have pressed Orlando to renovate it.

Maybe they tried and it was obvious it wasn’t going to work, but I wish they would have done everything to get move ST there

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Port Charlotte had the room to build

Tinker Field not so much. Tinker Field is smothered by the Citrus Dump on one side and crackwhoreville on the other side.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

and had no rooms for the practice fields and facilities these new places have

There was just one field for the Twins to use on site outside of the actual game field

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Orlando have any desire to get a minor league team back?

Maybe they would have to start brand new.

Again probably not feasable, but would have liked to see it explored.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Anything getting done would be at the Wide World of Sports complex which already has two teams

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

2 teams?

Just the Braves are here.

It’s a great stadium but awful place for minor league ball when you have the giant distraction of Disney right next door.

Orlando would be better served throwing money in a Tampa project than trying to get minor league ball back into the area.It would be embarrassing to throw money at a FSL team given the size of the market but rednecks are rednecks and rodeos draw bigger crowds than minor league baseball did when it was here.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Minor league crowds aren't big by minor league standards anywhere in Florida.q

But as I’ve mentioned before, I’d love to see an AAA stadium in Orlando.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

If they had a stadium like Brighthouse field in Clearwater

that had the Rays there for spring training and a the Rays FSL during the season they could definitely draw a few thousand a night imo.

They are never going to draw at Tinker

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

Where else do they put one?

They could demolish the old Amway and go there, but they couldn’t get that tacked on to the 3-headed monster funding bill that was just passed.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

I can't imagine a stadium would run more than $50 million total.

I know they want to do that innovation village or whatever at the O-Rena, but I don’t see that moving forward in this Obama economy.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

The arts center is still trying to get their $$

and the Citrus Bowl still has theirs to come. I wish they’d blow that piece of shit up and put money into a baseball yard and give the money to UCF to expand their football stadium

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

They should give UCF at least 10 million dollars to kill another kid...

look at the strides the team made since then.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

LOL

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

You think the players care that some nerd with a camera died?

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

No way.

Just like Kotchman wouldn’t care if one of his errant foul balls hit one of you nerds in the temple while you were too busy staring at spreadsheets to watch the game.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I picture you saying this in front of the mirror before every game you attend

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

You and me, both...

and everyone else in the area

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Clearwater does exceptionally well for A ball

Jacksonville did well with AA when I lived up there – great yard they have there.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Jacksonville is among the tops in SL in attendance.

You’re right. It’ll be interesting to see how the new Pensacola team does. That said, Clearwater draws maybe 2,000 a game, on average? That’s well below the Carolina and California League attendance at the same level. Tops in the FSL is like Daytona, at 2500-3000.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm pretty sure Clearwater is tops in the FSL...

I think Collette and I were talking baout that earlier this weak.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

You're right. Clearwater's attendance has gone up from what it used to be even just a couple years ago.

Clearwater 2571
Charlotte 2462
Daytona 2398
St. Lucie 1895
Tampa 1875
Fort Myers 1860
Brevard 1407
Bradenton 1322
Jupiter 1256
Palm Beach 1070
Lakeland 1040
Dunedin 639

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

Phillies fans tho...

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think it's all casual fans.

They used to draw Dunedin-like numbers in Jack Russell, and were around only St. Lucie levels even in their first couple of years at Bright House.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

90% of it is fat people going there on tuesdays to gorge

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

They did a good job...

thanks WT!

I would be pissed if I owned one of the dealerships on the Northbound side

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

What ones are there besides Clw Toyota

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

There was a very successful used car lot around the area across from B&N

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

That was never successful, it was basically a sleaze lot that sold impounded and repo'd cars

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sure...

TopGunNumba1, you know better about this than I do.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

Tell me about its boom times oh unknown insider

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

Pretty much it's entire existence as Countryside Cars

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's you, you're that George Baker

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jax's park is really incredible

They benefit from the Jag’s parking lots and it’s a breeze to get to

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I went there last year.

I was very impressed. It’s right across the street from the arena too. They have a nice complex over there.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought the Astros were there as well?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks, pretty close, but not exact

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

and they're only there in Feb/March

Place sits empty the rest of the season

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

Finally a place to put all the homeless, let them play the other 10 months and I bet they'd have a pretty good team in no time.

They’ve got nothing else to do

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oh no not a bad neighborhood that might steal a guys car, guns, and dignity

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

It was a stepping stone

But, like you, I hope they continue to work to expand it.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

The team would be losing 10-20M a year if they were carrying a higher payroll

At some point the magic is going to run out and the team will have to make a decision to either be a bottom 5 team with a bottom 5 payroll or gamble that they can be a top 5 team with a league average payroll. What they have done for the dollars they have spent is sheer brilliance that by definition is fleeting.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

Guess what Sandy? The team doesn't have a 20M higher payroll. They live within their means and can continue to do so.

A new stadium ANYWHERE is going to increase revenue, as will a new TV contract when the time is up.

If you want the stadium in Tampa fine, but you have to have a realistic funding idea to do so. There is a reasonable one in place in Pinellas.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Why the fuck would Pinellas fund a stadium in Hillsborough? Please think before you speak

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ugh...if other teams did it why couldn't the Tampa Bay Area?
Milwaukee: Passed a tax increase to five Milwaukee-area counties

by DaPriceIsRight on Jul 1, 2011 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

The Tampa Bay area sucks

They can’t get the county the stadium is in to pass funding

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are you new to this area?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm genuinely laughing at how you think you are arguing efficiently here. This is me: HA HA HA

You saw what they could do with $70M last year. That’s a pipe dream in their current location. Stay on topic and leave the strawmen alone. ITT we’re talking about the team making a yearly profit to keep asset value up. What is this reasonable funding idea in Pinellas and would you provide a link so I can check it out? If you don’t have one then you’re just doing exactly what Collette did which you jumped all over him for.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

What straw men captain debate club?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'll let you know once I see that link to the funding idea in St. Pete that's already been laid out

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'll find more, but here is a start. What's the strawman baby?
ST. PETERSBURG — The Tampa Bay Rays have developed a bold plan to build a $450-million downtown stadium that would give fans waterfront views and protection from rain.

The stadium, to be built on the site of Al Lang Field, would seat about 35,000 and could open as early as 2012. Hitters there would have a chance to send the ball into the bay.

Financing is still being worked out, but a primary source would be proceeds of the sale of the Tropicana Field site to a developer who would build a large retail/residential complex there. The Rays also would make a contribution, perhaps as much as $150-million, covering one-third of the cost.

The team also would seek legislative approval for $60-million of state money in future sales tax revenue from food, beer and merchandise sales in the new park.

http://www.sptimes.com/2007/11/10/Southpinellas/Rays_on_the_bay.shtml

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

How'd that work out?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Fart, pt 2
Several significant questions remain about financing, parking and the Florida heat.
Rays officials insist the project will not require new tax money. But the plan does call for $60-million in state tax money and property tax revenue from the redeveloped Tropicana Field site, as well as proceeds from the sale of that land.
The team says it believes it can stay within its $450-million stadium budget and, if not, would be responsible for any cost overruns.

“No new taxes,” Sternberg said.

http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/rays/content/rays-unveil-dramatic-ballpark-vision

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

How'd that work out?

What developer is buying that site for anything over $50K?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

You may have a business background but do you have a literacy background?
But seriously, look at the funding for the $450 mil sail project. How was that accomplished? Approx 1/3 by the team and 2/3 by the city/county from continuation of bed taxes and the sale of the trop land.
Obviously the sale of the trop land was a pipe dream number, so you can probably decrease the city/counties contribution by ~$50 million. Can’t $tinky $tu pony up the extra? This funding split should work anywhere in Pinellas county without actually costing the tax payers any money.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed “ooooown u poop”
by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Bed taxes will raise $250M?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

They already raise more than that, it's an extension

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

Per year?

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

No, not per year

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are you proposing they build a new stadium every year?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

Look, two stadiums is the only way to make this work so they better be prepared for that.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

they can always play a handful of series in The Trop

and Derek Jeter can always sign here once his next contract is out

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Seriously, my favorite part of that article was the convoluted time sharing and visitation rights portion

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

The current situation is not affording them the cashflow necessary to remain competitive in baseball.

Cleveland set forth a nice business model for what the Rays are doing now but did so knowing the stadium was coming and in fact opened in 96. No way Hart and crew could have done what they did with Baerga, Alomar, Nagy, etc and the retainer deals they had if they were stuck in the mistake by the lake.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

Revenue sharing didn't exist back then

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

Until it gets futher enhanced? It's been a huge boon for the sport, no way it goes away

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

'bout that franchise value

that part of the lease that prevents the team from moving, that has to lower the value of the franchise, no?

by BudGHG on Jul 1, 2011 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

That depends on what other markets are available and how realistic getting a new stadium in this area is

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

greetings from Busch Stadium

passing on a correction from another VEB member, guayzimi:

“It should be about $300 million private…
$40 million public. He probably assumed the bonds that financed most of costs are being paid back by the public, but they’re not. The team is paying that. It’s not a big deal, but credit should go where credit is due…”

would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jul 1, 2011 9:49 AM EDT reply actions  

Thanks

I was pulling the information from published sources so it appears to be a common mistake. I’ll adjust

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think the source was misread

The source I think was used says that:

Public financing: $45 million long-term loan from St. Louis County.
Private financing: $90.1 million from the Cardinals, $9.2 million in interest earned on the construction fund, and $200.5 million in bonds to be paid over a 22-year period ($15.9 million per year) by the team. Anheuser-Busch agreed to a 20 year naming rights deal (through the 2025 season) which will help offset construction costs.

Looks like the author confused the numbers. 45 mil was public and the 90+200 mil was private.

"Hunter Pence out at home, catcher Gerald Laird. Three out." STL @ HOU, 4/28/11

by hr on Jul 1, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

correction made at a 40/300 split

Thanks for the catch.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

Congrats on dealing with the topic of funding by not proposing a solution. Great piece!!!

“There are many different ways to fund a stadium, they should do one!” – Jason Collette in 2,000 words

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:50 AM EDT reply actions  

Better rush to the defense of your good pal you lazy carpet bagging filth.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are we going to talk about the issue at hand or are you going to act like a petulant child because people have opinions that differ from yours.

Collette, et al, have worked hard on this with the idea of generating feedback of what the community thinks. Not only are we fans, but most of us live in the area or have backgrounds that give us insight into many of the issues at play here. Yours is a valued opinion because you cover both aspects, but it’s not the only one.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Go back north yankee
most of us live in the area

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Keep giving us your opinion on what the local area has to do from Rochester New York

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

You have a business background!!! Oh shit, never mind, pontificate.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

But seriously, look at the funding for the $450 mil sail project. How was that accomplished? Approx 1/3 by the team and 2/3 by the city/county from continuation of bed taxes and the sale of the trop land.

Obviously the sale of the trop land was a pipe dream number, so you can probably decrease the city/counties contribution by ~$50 million. Can’t $tinky $tu pony up the extra? This funding split should work anywhere in Pinellas county without actually costing the tax payers any money.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

(There are also bond issuances in there IIRC)

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

69% of the profits go to a stadium fund.

good chance you’ll make less than $420.

@dobbertweets

by blackraven on Jul 1, 2011 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

Accountant's apprentice

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

I really don't like what RD has done.

No one can be trusted. I mean, how do we really know DPIR goes to SPC?

@dobbertweets

by blackraven on Jul 1, 2011 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

We know that didn't happen

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Went to Yaya's. Went to CFA. Some girl at CFA was clearly interested in my goods.

Told the GDT about it. Didn’t believe that I went to two places. Showed receipt from CFA with cashiers name. Showed bank transactions of me going to both places that night. Trolls trolling trolls.

by DaPriceIsRight on Jul 1, 2011 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nope

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't believe anyone's "job" any longer

I’m going to start demanding paystubs believe stuff. RD has ruined me.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Have you ever really appeared on radio?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Fictional and prissy?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

"My goodness"

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

You a broke sumbitch then

"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example." ~ Mark Twain

by LeeCaz on Jul 1, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

You mean french fries, garlic, salt, and olive oil put together are bad for you?

Well I never.

"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example." ~ Mark Twain

by LeeCaz on Jul 1, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Well, it's just Miller Lite, so it's 69% water

"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example." ~ Mark Twain

by LeeCaz on Jul 1, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

You are such a miserable shithead

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

At the risk of being Captain Obvious, we can all agree that the biggest issue here is funding.

I don’t see Hillsborough County voting in a tax increase for a stadium. At least not in the forseeable future.
I also don’t see St. Pete just caving and agreeing to a buyout so the Rays can move (not without significant fight).
As much as I would love this downtown Tampa project to work, I see it as a longshot for the above reasons.
As it sits right now, I think the best hope for the Rays to stay in the region is to work aggressively towards something in the Toytown area. It is not the ideal location, but this is not a perfect world.
This way Pinellas can keep the Rays without a huge legal battle, the Rays get a new Stadium, and the location has the POTENTIAL to draw in more of Hillsborough County. From our corporate offices in the Westshore area it wouldn’t take much time at all to get there.
Issues will still remain. The bridge perception will still be there. But I don’t see a more viable alternative as things currently stand.

Twitter: @mbleazy

by MikeB. on Jul 1, 2011 10:15 AM EDT reply actions  

shithead

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

It's on par with all of your horrible shithead comments

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree with this. It would be wonderful if the stadium were in downtown tampa and spurring. redevelopment there, but I can't see any way for it to get funded.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Because you're being myopic and only seeing the benefits of your idea and no others.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

BENEFITS AREN'T THE POINT. IT COSTS MONEY TO DO THINGS SANDY, YOU HAVE A BUSINESS BACKGROUND YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

So you can honestly say with a straight face that you think moving the team 5 miles north is going to magically open the floodgates as Tampa decides that the bridges that have kept them out no longer matter because the new open air stadium has a sail and

sits on a pile of garbage. You’re dreamin, bro. I like the initiative, you’re showing a lot of ambition. I like that, too bad you have no concept of what the common man thinks.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

The common man thinks "I want the stadium to be in Tampa, I'll gladly pay more in taxes" right? No, they don't. You may have a business background but you don't have a human psychology background

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

I know that once people are obligated to do something they tend to stop putting up a fight and that water is a psychological barrier that people are hesitant to cross

The goal should be building in a densely populated area that can feel the full thrust of corporate support. I’d love to see the toys of Misfit Island get together and write a check on behalf of Garbage Land, but I don’t really see that as realistic.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

I could see the county buying in on an extension of the CIT...

if it is sold well

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think it's an easier sell now that it's already in place

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Eh, like I said before.

It passed under exceptional circumstances and would have to do so again.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

ha

great flag

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

haha, way to add to the discussion RIUN

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

___

hrm

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't see Stu going for something less than ideal

For something this important it doesn’t make sense to settle.

I think he would rather wait longer and gain more leverage

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm right here, they're in no rush at this point as every day that goes by increases his leverage

If they’re truly in for the long haul they’re going to get what they want, where they want.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

If that's what it takes, fine let them wait. I don't have a problem with it

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

Team moves from a dump to an actual dump, can't wait to read those headlines

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

Haha that's great, do you have a journalism background too?

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

Just an overactive imagination

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

I hope I'm wrong on this.

I think Downtown Tampa is the best location. I just can’t wrap my head around how it gets paid for.

Twitter: @mbleazy

by MikeB. on Jul 1, 2011 10:21 AM EDT reply actions  

You can just copy and paste my posts if it helps

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'd love to go to the casino and hand out blankets sometime.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Injuns already own half the state, why not give them the other half

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

Get out Shitting Bull

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

I can see three ways forward

1) Stu, a group of investors & MLB build a new stadium and buy off St. Pete (1 % chance of happening)
2) Stu moves the team out of the area (49% chance of happening)
3) Stu sells the team (50% chance of happening)

I just don’t see a new stadium being built involving any public dollars. And there is no way one is being built without public dollars. Unless they start taking EBT for season tickets.

by nomoredevil on Jul 1, 2011 10:24 AM EDT reply actions  

Well reasoned IRIUN

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

I try

After all, I’m now doing 3% less work than before. Which leaves more time for pondering the Rays stadium situation

by nomoredevil on Jul 1, 2011 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

I still think the chances are far less than the team moves.

MLB isn’t the NBA, NHL, or even the NFL. There is a very high standard as to what markets can support a team; you can’t just plop down a stadium in Oklahoma City and expect an MLB team to be viable. This isn’t the 1950s or even the 90s where there are obvious open markets just begging to be tapped.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can't win em all I guess.

Just don’t want to drive over that 6.9 mile bridge just to meet my impending doom.

@RealNolenBailey

by Hatfield on Jul 1, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'M NEVER GOING TO A BASEBALL GAME AGAIN, YOU LOST YOUR CHANCE ST PETE

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

Guy also fell off his sinking boat and chopped his arm all up in the propellor.

So, of course, everyone has to come to a stop on the bridge to watch and make sure he dies and/or gets eaten by a shark.

Backing traffic up all down 275 onto I4, as well as gridlocking my attempted trip to the crosstown via 21st.

And that, friends, is how I stopped going to the Trop on weeknights.

The bear also died.

@RealNolenBailey

by Hatfield on Jul 1, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Tuesday.

When I attempted to go to the game, and instead pitched a hissyfit.

@RealNolenBailey

by Hatfield on Jul 1, 2011 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oh ya that traffic sucked

It wasn’t as bad as I thought it was going to be.

It cleared up about 1/4 way down the bridge.

I make that drive everyday and that was about as bad as it has ever been. That is not the norm or even close to it

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

I know.

I’ve had season tickets for years.

I just threw a tantrum.

@RealNolenBailey

by Hatfield on Jul 1, 2011 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

What is to stop Hillsborough from extending existing taxes? That would be the same thing Sternberg proposed...

and wouldn’t be the same as the 1/2 cent Transit Tax. IIRC, that’s the plan in Pinellas, right? “No New Taxes”

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 10:59 AM EDT reply actions  

Tampa Mayor has already shown more willingness to look at this than St. Pete has

and he’s not even allowed to say much of anything at all. But he’s made it clear he’s committed to keeping the Rays in the area, even if St. Pete is not.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

He can look at it all he wants but unless he finds a magic leprechaun that gives him free money I don't think it's going anywhere

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

It's easy to discuss when you don't have anything at stake

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

But shouldn't you be willing to talk about it even more when you have everything at stake?

When St. Pete decides to get their heads out of their ass and actually talk about it, odds are it will be too late. And it was already probably too late when they vehemently opposed the downtown stadium idea.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't even know how to respond to this, sorry

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

???

Easy to talk when nothing at stake. But what about when you have everything at stake? The longer you don’t talk the less you have time to put something together.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

It's not their responsibility to initiate the conversation.

It’s the Rays’ responsibility. St. Pete is satisfied; they have a lease for another 16 years and will get their value one way or another. If the Rays want to move earlier in that time frame, they need to be the ones driving the conversation. Maybe they’re negotiating to get out of the lease behind-the-scenes, IDK. Regardless, St. Pete is not going to, will not, and should not let the team out of its lease without conditions.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

They did with their last stadium proposal

They got no support. St. Pete just keeps saying “but the lease! But the lease!” And refuses to talk about anything…other than a off-hand comment that maybe something can be worked out “down the line” with no line in sight. And they only say that after Rays say they’d like to consider all of TB area. St. Pete Mayor says St. Pete or bust. But offers nothing else to consider. Rays have tried to initiate conversation, only to be shut down.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

They didn't even go to a vote with the proposal.

That was the last concrete step the Rays have taken. Foster has said he’s willing to discuss sites in St. Pete. The team wants different conditions, I.E. they want to break their lease. Sorry that St. Pete isn’t on board with that.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

The site doesn't matter if the area isn't going to support it, i.e. funding

They’ve already been down that road. And the area grew spiteful of the Rays. Activists got their tail feathers all druthered up and pranced around like they were big shit. “You’re not taking our waterfront property!”

Rays made their offer. They’ve waited for counter-offer. It never showed. At this point, either the area steps up more and deals with this, or the Rays will eventually buy out their lease and move to Tampa.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

.
At this point, either the area steps up more and deals with this, or the Rays will eventually buy out their lease and move to Tampa.

I don’t think St. Pete would be opposed to that if they were compensated fairly.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is asinine.

Foster has said he’s willing to look at a stadium in St. Pete. Are you seriously telling me it’s a demerit against Foster that he isn’t willing to let the team violate its lease without conditions?

Buckhorn is willing to look at it because he doesn’t have an existing asset to protect and can run his mouth while playing both sides of the fence. Foster doesn’t have that benefit.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Jul 1, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Any extension requires a vote. Hillsborough taxes are on the residents that vote, Pinellas' are on tourists.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

But what about the redistricting that they've been talking about?

Is there anyway to implement a tourist tax through that?

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think Hills has the tourist base to make it work

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

Casinos though?

Aren’t they planning to expand the Hard Rock?

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Injuns wampum that money, its tribal land

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not saying it will pass

but it’s much easier when you are getting something new rather then just keeping a team you already had.

This works in Tampa’s favor.

by Sveet on Jul 1, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Also easier to sell someone on something they are already paying for...

“You want to keep status quo AND have a championship-caliber baseball team playing in a beautiful new waterfront stadium that is 15 minutes away?”

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

Literally what you say upon seeing any text

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

There's a picture of watermelons somewhere in here

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

Kind of yes on both accounts

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

This is your emotional state right now

And it’s not about the team losing money, it’s about having a league average payroll and still making money

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Wish there were more train in this thread

That being said, isn’t the whole stadium discussion boiled down to for now when St Pete stops playing chicken & accepts a buyout?

PIZZA?!?

by Transplanted on Jul 1, 2011 11:47 AM EDT reply actions  

Now that were back in the atmosphere....

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

No, the whole stadium discussion is not boiled down to that

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

The stadium discussion is boiled down to complex regional issues, politics, and funding sources

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

No

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

You're wrong, St. Pete residents think that moving the stadium 4 miles from it's current location and turning it from a crisp 72 degrees into a 90 degree sauna (80 degrees with 100% humidity with the sail up!)

is well worth not pissing off the date that brought them to the dance.

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

Great, now you're polluting the dump with cold air

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Colonial Patriot Jun 30, 2011 11:32 PM
Once these thug corrupt cops get to prison Bubba is going to thank them for all of their “community service”

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bubba Says Jul 1, 2011 3:16 AM
I am Bubba. And I gonna make this guy squeal like a little piggie. I gonna choke his chicken and make him dance. Oh my oh my…I gonna have fun with him!!! Oh-la-la.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

They are all Chef Paul Prudhomme

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

You wish you could get at that, doughboy

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

.

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Random thought, but I would love it if the Rays traded for J.J. Hardy

Don’t know what it would cost to sign him, but 3 yr, 21 mil would be a great price. But my guess is he makes 3, 30 or 3, 33 at least.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 12:08 PM EDT reply actions  

That's $21 mil less for the stadium in Tampa. Say good by to fire extinguishers and handrails

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

goodbye if you will

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

he's apparently talking long-term with the O's

to bridge the gap to Machado. I love Hardy

I'm not a fanboy, I'm a _______

by Jason Collette on Jul 1, 2011 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

O's trying to see if it's possible for long-term deal to see if they should put him on trade market or not

and it all depends if he wants to stay with the O’s. Rays definitely have some payroll flexibility, depending upon what they want to do with Shields, Upton, Damon, etc.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dave Cameron says he's the best value SS that could be available

http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/insider/news/story?id=6728797. Need insider to read full article, but it’s always an added bonus to get production out of a premium position. And he’s in the prime of his career, only 28. Trade them Brignac and Niemann and you have your bridge until Lee/Beckham are ready.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Do you have any other horrible trade ideas?

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes.

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

r u serious?

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

We could pay Billy Butler that money and have a real player for the same trade package

@SandyKazmir
Yes I've only been a fan since 2009.
by blackraven on May 5, 2011 3:46 PM EDT

by Sandy Kazmir on Jul 1, 2011 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm not opposed to both :)

and a former 4 WAR player, who still posted a 2.5 WAR last year with the Twins in part-time duty, who might finally be healthy for the first time in a while, I would consider a real player.

by raysfaninminnesota on Jul 1, 2011 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Attn RJ:
tbird4justice Jul 1, 2011 2:32 AM
Sorry, referring to “colonial patriot” – I guess no one else is a real American unless he’s a rich property owner – pathetic.

The caller said the boy, after removing the bulb from its socket, left the building and threw the bulb on the ground. When the bulb broke, the caller said the boy screamed "ooooown u poop"

by Top Gun Numba 1 on Jul 1, 2011 12:13 PM EDT reply actions  

I echo this...

this was a great series

Boom. Outta Here.

I am sure your god would be so proud you plaster his name onto money and license plates and bumper stickers. Such reverence. Nothing says how pious you are than to plaster a cheap bumper sticker to your god on a Kia.

@RyanGilliss

by Ryan Gilliss on Jul 1, 2011 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

<3

Sign lady must die.
Follow me on Twitter @Josh_Frank

by EminenceFront on Jul 1, 2011 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

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