Dukes To Nationals, Again?

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 8:08 PM EST

Corky over at Rays Index somehow dug up a Dominican news site that says -- in Spanish -- the Nationals want Dukes but don't want to give up their main prospect launchers / pitching prospects.

I had heard some rumblings from a non-Rays source about a move being in the works around midday, but nothing so specific as Dukes to Washington who has had interest before. It would be amusing if one of Chuck LaMar's drafted pitchers is the return price for Dukes, perhaps Glenn Gibson.

AOL Sports has some more translations, notably:
They quote an unnamed source close to talks between the Nats and D-Rays as saying: "We are going to be clear, the [Devil] Rays want Dukes to leave and there are people in Washington that think that the boy is not so problematico as they paint it."
The report states Dukes himself "has commented to some of his companions in the winter league that he urgently needs to leave Tampa to reorient his career."

Apparently David Chalk at Bugs and Cranks was the first to find it, Chalk's also on a self described "crusade" to keep the Devil around or whatever, anyhow the reason our site remains DRaysBay isn't because we're fighting a war, but you know the whole thing about another site being called RaysBay -- not to mention DRB is pretty synonymous with Rays' coverage.

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Re: Dukes To Nationals, Again?

Chad Cordero would be ideal but highly unlikely.

How 'bout Willy Mo Pena? That'd give the Rays a power hitter who could DH and the flexibility to move Crawford for pitching.

Jesus Colome is always a possibility. ;)

by floridaroar on Nov 14, 2007 8:28 PM EST reply actions

Jesus for Elijah

"We call it the Bible trade..."

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 8:31 PM EST up reply actions

Re: Dukes To Nationals, Again?

Have to say all of this ASAP...

Dukes has a far greater downside than any sort of potential. Ditch him into rehab.
Trading Carl Crawford before we know if DY and B.J. will fully mature is insane. It would send the message (correct or not) that Sternberg is giving up on the organization and the fans. Especially with plans for a new stadium...
Am I the only guy really wanting to sign a solid and dependable mid-rotation workhorse like, I don't know, Jeff Suppan?
Get Tampa Bay back on the road uni's...NOW!!!!!

Thanks...

by levyco matt on Nov 14, 2007 8:31 PM EST reply actions

To answer four

See yesterday's post about Carl to Chicago, Mark Fernandez did an interview with Bobby Fenton yesterday and sounded optimistic about the chances.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 8:32 PM EST up reply actions

To answer the others

We'll have to agree to disagree.
When you say fully mature, are we talking on the field? If so B.J. at fully matured level might be a Hall of Famer.
Like Carlos Silva? I'm not sure we should try and sign a free agent starter, at this point there's nobody really worth the money out there.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 8:38 PM EST up reply actions

Re: To answer the others

Yes, B.J. is almost (almost...) a lock to be solid year after year. But you can't say the same about Delmon after this last year. The numbers were great, but can he keep up his on-field effort and get along with coaches/management? I don't want to banish CC if Delmon is touted as his offensive/consistency replacement.

Since I think Suppan is locked up for a year or two, maybe he won't work. Silva's too pricey, but there has to be some available veteran SP out there just waiting to give us 6 innings after Kazmir and Shields.

by levyco matt on Nov 14, 2007 8:50 PM EST up reply actions

Re: To answer the others

Suppan signed a 5 year deal last off-season, he's not available, and yes there are vets who could give you 6 IP -- Weaver, Maroth, ect. -- but they'd allow 5-6 earned runs while doing so.

Delmon had a disappointing season last year, but I really don't question his motivation -- he'll want to get paid in a few years he'll play well, I don't see him being a Sheffield headcase who sucks to get out of town.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 8:53 PM EST up reply actions

Re: Dukes To Nationals, Again?

Wrong...sorry but your wrong. I have seen plenty of bad divorces, now add a million dollars and being under 25
I see the point about how the fans would look at it, especially with im getting ready to ask for money, but do you really think he is going to trade Crawford without thinking it will help win now? The public perception would be soooo bad that if they didn't win this next season it would be over for this ownership group. there would be no fixing it. He knows that so the only way Crawford is going to go is if this will help next seaon and for a few years down the road.
I would rather just trade for a pitcher who gets wins. we had 2 200 plus inning pithers this year, but theyalso know how to win. This workhorse would be our number 3 pitcher so I would want one that can win more than half of his games.
I heard a rumor that he said he will have it back on the uni's in 09.

by Elgrandeplatano on Nov 14, 2007 10:35 PM EST up reply actions

Oh come on

It is absolutely unbelievable how many people will continue to tolerate this Dukes charade. He is clearly culpable in this divorce, just as the other party is. Both acted in poor taste, but sending threats to your estranged spouse and your children goes over the line. Add in the string of thuggery that has plagued Dukes' professional career, and it is time to say that enough is enough.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Nov 16, 2007 2:36 PM EST up reply actions

Re: Dukes To Nationals, Again?

hahahahahahahahahhaha

by sattp on Nov 15, 2007 12:10 AM EST up reply actions

As far as this deal

I'm going to assume we go with the Rays Way rule of never seeing the trade coming. I wouldn't be shocked to see Dukes traded, but I would highly preference someone a bit more...desirable than the National pitchers.

If we just dump Dukes for whatever we can get I'll be highly disappointed.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 8:57 PM EST reply actions

I would take Glenn Gibson for Dukes and run

I don't want that man anywhere near this organization come next spring, and if we can get a good player for him.....ever the better. Face it, he has no value. He sucked at the major league level and he has a history of being a nutcase. He has tremendous talent, but it will never come to fruition and I am firmly convinced of that.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Nov 16, 2007 2:38 PM EST up reply actions

I really like Glenn Gibson

I haven't seen a scouting report on him, but he's 6-4 and 195, so he's still very projectable, and he is rated as having the best control and changeup in the National's system. I don't know exactly how good that changeup is, but he's a lefty who held righties to a .203 average, while lefties hit .283 off of him, so he needs to work on his breaking ball. He also had a 0.93 ERA on the road, so I wonder how much of a hitter's park Vermont is?

He seems like he has a really high upside, so I'm not sure if Bowden would give him up for Dukes, but if he would, that would be great.

by raysrule07 on Nov 14, 2007 11:10 PM EST reply actions

His numbers caught my eye

I'm just not sure I want to trade Dukes for a low level pitcher, it feels defeating in some ways, however if we do trade him to the Nats Gibson would be my choice.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 11:12 PM EST up reply actions

Re: I really like Glenn Gibson

Vermont's rotation all had insanely low ERAs this season.

As for our chances of getting him, I'd guess very low because Rizzo is finally fixing the Nats' farm system and pitching is a huge need for them.

by Jacob Larsen on Nov 15, 2007 6:39 PM EST up reply actions

Re: I really like Glenn Gibson

His ERA isn't what I like about him.

by raysrule07 on Nov 15, 2007 9:44 PM EST up reply actions

His K:BB rate is nearly 4

I like that from a 19 year old, should only get better.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 15, 2007 9:59 PM EST up reply actions

Low Level Pitchers

Doesn't have to be protected on the 40-man roster for 2 years.
Has very high upside.
Probably the best we can get for Dukes.
Low level prospects can easily bust, but they can also become a Dan Haren.

Sure, low level prospects are a risk, but so is keeping Dukes, I think the risk/reward is pretty even.

by raysrule07 on Nov 14, 2007 11:30 PM EST reply actions

I wasn't talking about the risk

There's risk with Dukes as you mentioned, but you do bring up some valid points.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 14, 2007 11:32 PM EST up reply actions

I think I see what you mean

Trading a major league player for a low-level minor leaguer feels like a step backwards. I can understand that, I just think getting rid of Dukes will help this organization move forward.

by raysrule07 on Nov 14, 2007 11:43 PM EST up reply actions

Re: Dukes To Nationals, Again?

I think making smart trades and putting a winning team on the field with help this organization move forward. Why is everyone so apposed to giving Dukes a second chance? If he screws up again then we get rid of him.

How he has acted since the "Crime Dog" became a sort of a mentor to him has earned him a second chance in my eyes.

Different circumstances but we gave Hickey one afte the DUI (as did BJ), Delmon got one after his bat throwing incident, and Salas got one after juicing up.

On another note Stokes, Fossum, and Seo got plenty of undesearving chance lol

by Elgrandeplatano on Nov 15, 2007 8:40 AM EST reply actions

McGriff

Prevent a Crime, Dawg

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 15, 2007 2:46 PM EST up reply actions

This can't be happening!

Second chance? This is Dukes' 20th chance, and he has screwed up about 19 times before. He has a track record of being an idiot and fumbling every opportunity that comes his way, no matter how gift-wrapped it may be. Trading away Dukes for a good low level prospect is a smart trade. It will help this organization move foward from the debacle that is Dukes' tenure here, and we can finally stop with this circus crap. You say that if he screws up again, he's gone, but do you really mean that? The problem is, he keeps screwing up and it is all his own doing. No matter how many apologists want to divert blame for his problems around, he is ultimately culpable. Where does the line get drawn in the sand? To me, it already has been drawn. And we crossed it long ago.

I keep hearing this nonsense about 'the Crime Dog' being a mentor to him and all, and yet I see nothing to substantiate that. What has McGriff done? Arrange for him donate some equipment and coach for some two-bit semi-pro team? If that is a major stride in your eye, you seriously need to get some perspective. The fact of the matter is, he has shown up tardy or absent for his court hearings throughout the divorce process, and when he did show up he usually showed a disregard for the proceedings, aside from one occasion that I remember.

You mention the other people with trouble in our organization, yet the common thread with those people is that their infractions stop right there. There isn't this 20-page long FDLE criminal record and a similarly long employee file full of suspensions and alteractions that Dukes has.

We need to move forward from this, we just do. It is getting outright ridiculous.

by Patrick L. Kennedy on Nov 16, 2007 2:47 PM EST up reply actions

Re: Dukes To Nationals, Again?

what about?

Nats get: Elijah Dukes
Rays get: Jonathan Albaladejo OR Luis Ayala

Jonathan Albaladejo, he is young, BIG, and has had success at every stop through the Nats system...

by nittsallgood on Nov 15, 2007 2:46 PM EST reply actions

I'd take either

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 15, 2007 2:47 PM EST up reply actions

So would I

Though I'd prefer Gibson to either.

by raysrule07 on Nov 15, 2007 2:57 PM EST reply actions

We seem to have some luck with HS pitchers

Of LaMar's later tenure, so perhaps that would be the way to go.

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 15, 2007 3:05 PM EST up reply actions

Gibson looks good...

but he is so young- thats always so scary, but I have to agree with the two of you...

by nittsallgood on Nov 15, 2007 3:15 PM EST reply actions

Not as scary

As Dukes still being here. He has said himself that he needs to get out of the area to get his life straight again and stay out of trouble. He needs to get out of here, for our sake and his.

by raysrule07 on Nov 15, 2007 4:22 PM EST up reply actions

That irritates me

by R.J. Anderson on Nov 15, 2007 4:23 PM EST up reply actions

Re: Not as scary

That is a cop out. My friend smokes alot of reefer and started getting into coke, so he decided to move to Ohio with his dad to start over. Guess what happened? He was back 5 months later because he got his little brother high and his dad found out. So he went there to get away from it all and just found it up there.

Changing your scenery won't change a person, you have to really want to change. If Dukes wants to make a change in his life it does not matter where he is, he just needs to do it.

by Elgrandeplatano on Nov 15, 2007 4:39 PM EST up reply actions

For every story of people who didn't change

There are stories of people who did change. Yes, the person has to want to change, but that is much more difficult if their surroundings stay the same. Changing where he is won't automatically get his life back on track again, but it will surely help to get him away from all the distractions around the Tampa/St. Pete area.

by raysrule07 on Nov 15, 2007 9:46 PM EST up reply actions